Baird going to UN to oppose Palestinian statehood bid

You can't have a two state solution without two states.

Why the Harperites have to kiss Israels butt twice a day is still a mystery. Its not helping any Canadians.

As much as it pains me to say this, I agree with you on this one. The sooner we stop kissing Israeli ass and let them sort out their own problems, which they themselves created, the better.

Let the U.S. keep kissing. Let's keep Canada away from this crap. The Middle East will always be a mess, and it's really none of our concern.

-J.

No peace, no peace deal, no support for statehood.

Hamas doesnt want it anyway, and the PA doesn't control Gaza.


There is no state.

They don't even share the same history. The West Bank Arabs are Jordanians and Gazan Arabs are Egyptians.

While I agree with you that this area will always and forever be a mess, I think it's nice to see Canada take a stance on something for a change.

We're the masters of sitting on the fence, worried about who we'll offend if we take a particular stance.

The Israelis are still mostly a legit democracy, even if the Netanyahu govt kind of sucks. Give them recognition and the Palestinians will just set up another theocratic fascist shit-show. They also never repudiated or apologized for their decades of terrorism and murder that killed hundreds of non-Israeli civilians in Europe and other areas of the Mid-East. Their leadership is still the same clique of murderous psychotics that they were when the Soviets and East Bloc secret police first financed and trained them back in the 1960's.

Not our problem. We should support the two state solution, or stay out of it. Being Israels lap dog isn't going to gain us favours in the international community. It destroys our credibility as a neutral voice of reason. And it makes us a target for Jihadis who believe in the Zionist crusade. Its terrible policy that allies us with bullies.

Not our problem. We should support the two state solution, or stay out of it. Being Israels lap dog isn't going to gain us favours in the international community. It destroys our credibility as a neutral voice of reason. And it makes us a target for Jihadis who believe in the Zionist crusade. Its terrible policy that allies us with bullies.

Actually backing corrupt and hostile regimes is where one looses credibility. How many times does it have to be proven that taking a pacifist stance against such regimes doesn't inspire them to become legitimate democratic societies? That's the entire problem with the UN, too many nations coddle or overlook the crimes that such nations commit in the hopes that these regimes will somehow come around to our way of thinking and become peaceful societies. It doesn�t work. These regimes need to first show that they are willing to be peaceful before they are recognized as being legitimate, not the other way around.

Everyone (on the surface anyway) supports the two state solution. The reality is that Israel now has full spectrum military dominance in the entire region. Conventional war didn't defeat them and neither has years of terrorism. Aside from a nuclear attack, which will surely result in the total obliteration of Iran and whoever else might be involved, the Israelis are as close to existing in an unassailable position as anyone can be. The pro-peace movement in Israel that might have been able to exert some influence on their own government came to a effective end after the last Palestinian intafadeh wiped out any lingering sympathetic feelings Israeli leftists had for them. Overall there's no compelling reasons remaining to move Israel to negotiate or compromise anymore. The overall war will surely go on for another sixty years but right now the Israelis are the effective winners. And the winners don't have to make any deals if they don't want to. Another pointless vote in the Muslim-controlled UN won't make a single bit of difference.

Not everyone supports a two state solution. Some like Harper pay lip service to it, but oppose recognition of one of the states at every opportunity. Talk about pointless votes all you want, but this one is expected to pass, and nobody has a veto. Its pointless opposition to a very important vote, that opposes a two state solution.

I think you nailed it here.

It's similar to what I've said in the past--this situation has existed in more or less the same state for several decades now. This is because neither side really wants it to change, diplomatic niceties notwithstanding. Israel wants the land and doesn't want to deal with the refugee issue. Corrupt Palestinian officials want a handy foil to blame on their woes on.

I don't understand Canada's--or the media's--fascination with this subject at all. To me, it's the most boring story on the planet. It never changes.

Not our problem. We should support the two state solution, or stay out of it. Being Israels lap dog isn't going to gain us favours in the international community. It destroys our credibility as a neutral voice of reason. And it makes us a target for Jihadis who believe in the Zionist crusade. Its terrible policy that allies us with bullies.

Actually backing corrupt and hostile regimes is where one looses credibility. How many times does it have to be proven that taking a pacifist stance against such regimes doesn't inspire them to become legitimate democratic societies? That's the entire problem with the UN, too many nations coddle or overlook the crimes that such nations commit in the hopes that these regimes will somehow come around to our way of thinking and become peaceful societies. It doesn�t work. These regimes need to first show that they are willing to be peaceful before they are recognized as being legitimate, not the other way around.

We trade with China.......happily. Hardly the example of freedom and democracy.

Agree.

Not our business.

All good points. But smart winners make deals and concessions when they are in the catbird seat, don't wait till things turn against them.

With Barak resigning, and all 25 first place positions for Likud being held by far rightists and settler nut cases, Likud may find itself far too radical for Israel. Netanyahoo has lost any ability to move to the center with this development, and it only takes a shift of 4% of the vote and he's out.

A two state solution seems like the only viable one. As long as the Israelis keep gobbling up land, they show they have no interest in this. Doesn't leave the Palestinians anywhere to go. Desperate people do desperate things