[Jabberwalker]

Vamp018 Vamp018:

Jabberwalker Jabberwalker:

Yeah. I've heard that the Americans want a land route into Alaska, too.

Yah and I heard Canada want a pipeline to Texas?? Get digging Canada Texas portion is already done and active. Oh and we don't need a road to Alaska. US citizens love to travel via Canadian Roads and spend money in Canada. Personally I'd like land 100,000 US Troops and Tactical Nukes in Ukraine and ram it up Putin's A@@.

Yup. "Canada" wants a pipeline to give away our precious oil to a neighbour that believes it and everything else is actually THEIRS ... at below market prices. Bad old Canada. Get yer gun.

[DrCaleb]

Vamp018 Vamp018:

Oh and we don't need a road to Alaska. US citizens love to travel via Canadian Roads and spend money in Canada.

Just a point of interest - the Alaska Highway (runs past my place) was built by the US Army Corp of Engineers. One of the most beautiful drives on the planet.

[BartSimpson]

Jabberwalker Jabberwalker:

Yeah. I've heard that the Americans want a land route into Alaska, too.

We've had that since WW2. Now what we (and the Russians) want is a rail line to connect Alaska to Canada and then to the USA. The Russians eventually want a tunnel under the Bering Strait to connect Asia and North America and such a thing would almost eradicate Chinese, Korean, and Japanese dominance in trans-Pacific shipping.

Connecting Alaska to Canada via rail makes the Bering Strait tunnel more likely.

[Jabberwalker]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Vamp018 Vamp018:

Oh and we don't need a road to Alaska. US citizens love to travel via Canadian Roads and spend money in Canada.

Just a point of interest - the Alaska Highway (runs past my place) was built by the US Army Corp of Engineers. One of the most beautiful drives on the planet.

I've driven part of it. It was built mostly by American soldiers but thousands of Canadian soldiers worked on it as well.

(I was just joking about the land connection to Alaska but one of our Southern Cuz's don't do irony.)

[BartSimpson]

The Russians are building up for an invasion:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/a ... ine-border

And they're on a full-court propaganda push to justify it:

http://en.ria.ru/world/20140410/1891417 ... ign=buffer

Bullsh*t Russian propaganda in BOLD:

$1:

DONETSK, Ukraine, April 10 (RIA Novosti) – A ragtag band of US mercenaries, Ukrainian National Guard soldiers, and fighters from the radical Right Sector movement have arrived in the eastern Ukrainian city of Donetsk to raid a building occupied by anti-government protestors, a leader of a local militia group told RIA Novosti on Thursday.

“About a hundred people from the National Guard are housed at the Donetsk airport,” said Sergey Tsyplakov, the deputy director of a local group called the People’s Militia of the Donbas.

“Around a hundred Right Sector thugs are also in the city, as well as a hundred employees from a private US military company operating under contract with the Kiev junta,” he added.

“In total, there are around 300 professionals and well-trained and motivated fanatics,” Tsyplakov said. “This is a major force, but we are ready to fight.”

Pro-federalization protesters have built three lines of barricades in front of the main entrance of the Donetsk regional administration building. The defensive fortifications – decorated with Russian and regional flags and anti-fascist slogans – are made from pieces of furniture, barbed wire and car parts.

Around a hundred people spent the night near the barricades prepared to defend against an expected attack by government forces. The protesters enforced the barricades with blocks they removed from a nearby park’s stone paving, and piled stones inside the defensive perimeter. People were burning bonfires to stay warm in front of the barricades and singing songs.

"Representatives of Kiev have repeatedly told us to lay down the firearms which, in their opinion, we possess. However, neither I, nor anyone else, have seen any weapons here. We are defending ourselves by impromptu means," Tsyplakov said.

Donetsk police have refused to disperse the protesters occupying the building.

Pro-federalization supporters occupied several government buildings in the city on Monday. They declared the formation of an independent “people’s republic” and announced plans to schedule a referendum by mid-May on declaring independence and joining Russia. Similar events took place in nearby Kharkiv, the country's second largest city.

Ukrainian acting Interior Minister Arsen Avakov told journalists Wednesday that a “special police task force” had already arrived in Donetsk and Kharkiv from western regions of Ukraine and was ready to take them under control within 48 hours, by force if necessary.

The minister's threat came in defiance of warnings by Moscow and international experts that a violent crackdown on the demonstrators – who are seeking increased local autonomy – risked escalating the crisis and plunging the country into a civil war.

I really enjoy the cheekiness of the Russians in their 'warnings' to Ukraine that boil down to:

$1:

If you fight back while we rape you we'll do more than just rob you of your country.

Damned shame that Ukraine doesn't have nukes because Moscow sure needs one.

[BRAH]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

The Russians are building up for an invasion:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/a ... ine-border

And they're on a full-court propaganda push to justify it:

http://en.ria.ru/world/20140410/1891417 ... ign=buffer

Bullsh*t Russian propaganda in BOLD:

$1:

DONETSK, Ukraine, April 10 (RIA Novosti) – A ragtag band of US mercenaries, Ukrainian National Guard soldiers, and fighters from the radical Right Sector movement have arrived in the eastern Ukrainian city of Donetsk to raid a building occupied by anti-government protestors, a leader of a local militia group told RIA Novosti on Thursday.

“About a hundred people from the National Guard are housed at the Donetsk airport,” said Sergey Tsyplakov, the deputy director of a local group called the People’s Militia of the Donbas.

“Around a hundred Right Sector thugs are also in the city, as well as a hundred employees from a private US military company operating under contract with the Kiev junta,” he added.

“In total, there are around 300 professionals and well-trained and motivated fanatics,” Tsyplakov said. “This is a major force, but we are ready to fight.”

Pro-federalization protesters have built three lines of barricades in front of the main entrance of the Donetsk regional administration building. The defensive fortifications – decorated with Russian and regional flags and anti-fascist slogans – are made from pieces of furniture, barbed wire and car parts.

Around a hundred people spent the night near the barricades prepared to defend against an expected attack by government forces. The protesters enforced the barricades with blocks they removed from a nearby park’s stone paving, and piled stones inside the defensive perimeter. People were burning bonfires to stay warm in front of the barricades and singing songs.

"Representatives of Kiev have repeatedly told us to lay down the firearms which, in their opinion, we possess. However, neither I, nor anyone else, have seen any weapons here. We are defending ourselves by impromptu means," Tsyplakov said.

Donetsk police have refused to disperse the protesters occupying the building.

Pro-federalization supporters occupied several government buildings in the city on Monday. They declared the formation of an independent “people’s republic” and announced plans to schedule a referendum by mid-May on declaring independence and joining Russia. Similar events took place in nearby Kharkiv, the country's second largest city.

Ukrainian acting Interior Minister Arsen Avakov told journalists Wednesday that a “special police task force” had already arrived in Donetsk and Kharkiv from western regions of Ukraine and was ready to take them under control within 48 hours, by force if necessary.

The minister's threat came in defiance of warnings by Moscow and international experts that a violent crackdown on the demonstrators – who are seeking increased local autonomy – risked escalating the crisis and plunging the country into a civil war.

I really enjoy the cheekiness of the Russians in their 'warnings' to Ukraine that boil down to:

$1:

If you fight back while we rape you we'll do more than just rob you of your country.

Damned shame that Ukraine doesn't have nukes because Moscow sure needs one.

Shame on the Obama Administration who doesn't live up to the obligation the United States made to Ukraine in exchange for giving up it's nuclear arsenal.

[Gunnair]

BRAH BRAH:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

The Russians are building up for an invasion:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/a ... ine-border

And they're on a full-court propaganda push to justify it:

http://en.ria.ru/world/20140410/1891417 ... ign=buffer

Bullsh*t Russian propaganda in BOLD:

$1:

DONETSK, Ukraine, April 10 (RIA Novosti) – A ragtag band of US mercenaries, Ukrainian National Guard soldiers, and fighters from the radical Right Sector movement have arrived in the eastern Ukrainian city of Donetsk to raid a building occupied by anti-government protestors, a leader of a local militia group told RIA Novosti on Thursday.

“About a hundred people from the National Guard are housed at the Donetsk airport,” said Sergey Tsyplakov, the deputy director of a local group called the People’s Militia of the Donbas.

“Around a hundred Right Sector thugs are also in the city, as well as a hundred employees from a private US military company operating under contract with the Kiev junta,” he added.

“In total, there are around 300 professionals and well-trained and motivated fanatics,” Tsyplakov said. “This is a major force, but we are ready to fight.”

Pro-federalization protesters have built three lines of barricades in front of the main entrance of the Donetsk regional administration building. The defensive fortifications – decorated with Russian and regional flags and anti-fascist slogans – are made from pieces of furniture, barbed wire and car parts.

Around a hundred people spent the night near the barricades prepared to defend against an expected attack by government forces. The protesters enforced the barricades with blocks they removed from a nearby park’s stone paving, and piled stones inside the defensive perimeter. People were burning bonfires to stay warm in front of the barricades and singing songs.

"Representatives of Kiev have repeatedly told us to lay down the firearms which, in their opinion, we possess. However, neither I, nor anyone else, have seen any weapons here. We are defending ourselves by impromptu means," Tsyplakov said.

Donetsk police have refused to disperse the protesters occupying the building.

Pro-federalization supporters occupied several government buildings in the city on Monday. They declared the formation of an independent “people’s republic” and announced plans to schedule a referendum by mid-May on declaring independence and joining Russia. Similar events took place in nearby Kharkiv, the country's second largest city.

Ukrainian acting Interior Minister Arsen Avakov told journalists Wednesday that a “special police task force” had already arrived in Donetsk and Kharkiv from western regions of Ukraine and was ready to take them under control within 48 hours, by force if necessary.

The minister's threat came in defiance of warnings by Moscow and international experts that a violent crackdown on the demonstrators – who are seeking increased local autonomy – risked escalating the crisis and plunging the country into a civil war.

I really enjoy the cheekiness of the Russians in their 'warnings' to Ukraine that boil down to:

$1:

If you fight back while we rape you we'll do more than just rob you of your country.

Damned shame that Ukraine doesn't have nukes because Moscow sure needs one.

Shame on the Obama Administration who doesn't live up to the obligation the United States made to Ukraine in exchange for giving up it's nuclear arsenal.

I wouldn't stop there. No one is interested in anything but words.

Besides, 76% of Americans do not support military intervention. What do recommend Obama to do with those stats?

[saturn_656]

Obama isn't up for re-election. Opinion polls mean squat for him.

[BRAH]

Gunnair Gunnair:

I wouldn't stop there. No one is interested in anything but words.

Besides, 76% of Americans do not support military intervention. What do recommend Obama to do with those stats?

Obama has shown he governs by polls so he will do nothing but draw lines Putin will continue to cross while Lurch uses big words.

[BartSimpson]

BRAH BRAH:

Shame on the Obama Administration who doesn't live up to the obligation the United States made to Ukraine in exchange for giving up it's nuclear arsenal.

My Estonian friends are VERY nervous about Obama especially since Russia started rattling about the 'rights' of Russians in Estonia this past month. Most of them don't believe Obama would answer the call if Estonia invoked Article V of the North Atlantic Treaty.

God bless the Estonians, they won't go down without a fight. If Russian troops cross the Estonian frontier then the Russians will get to see what a 21st Century cyberwar looks like because that's exactly how Estonia is planning to respond.

[Zipperfish]

Hard to fault Obama when Ukraine hasn't done much to defend their country either.

[BartSimpson]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

Hard to fault Obama when Canada hasn't done much to defend their country either.

Look how easily that phrase can be turned.

No insult intended, my point is that the US made a promise and Obama's broken it. Why not break any other promise?

In any case, it's not the fault of the Ukrainians that they haven't defended themselves from their one-time partner, Russia, any more than it is Canada's fault for not defending itself from the USA.

This time last year the notion of Russia invading Ukraine was as ludicrous as the US invading Canada. Again, no offense, but you probably would've mocked anyone who even suggested the idea of Russia invading Ukraine and anschlussing Crimea as being paranoid.

On an aside, this is a fine place to note that it was Sarah Palin back in 2008 who said that Russia would invade Ukraine if Obama took the White House.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelpeck ... t-ukraine/

$1:

“After the Russian Army invaded the nation of Georgia, Senator Obama’s reaction was one of indecision and moral equivalence, the kind of response that would only encourage Russia’s Putin to invade Ukraine next,” Palin claimed in 2008, during her vice-presidential bid alongside John McCain.

Palin, already mocked for claiming that she could see Russia from Alaska, was criticized for her Ukraine prediction. Among the critics was Foreign Policy Magazine, which described her forecast as “strange” and an “an extremely far-fetched scenario.”

I quoted the second paragraph to underline my point that the idea that Ukraine needed to arm itself against Russia would've been derided as 'strange' and 'extremely far-fetched'.

And Ukraine's actions prior to this debacle were then quite rational based on the best information available.

[martin14]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

Hard to fault Obama when Ukraine hasn't done much to defend their country either.

Neither did the Czechs, once they realized they had been sold out by the same people

who were supposed to guarantee their borders as well.



I think it will be different if Putin goes for the mainland.

[Zipperfish]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

BRAH BRAH:

Shame on the Obama Administration who doesn't live up to the obligation the United States made to Ukraine in exchange for giving up it's nuclear arsenal.

My Estonian friends are VERY nervous about Obama especially since Russia started rattling about the 'rights' of Russians in Estonia this past month. Most of them don't believe Obama would answer the call if Estonia invoked Article V of the North Atlantic Treaty.

God bless the Estonians, they won't go down without a fight. If Russian troops cross the Estonian frontier then the Russians will get to see what a 21st Century cyberwar looks like because that's exactly how Estonia is planning to respond.

I believe Estonia is a member of NATO, aren't they? That is a different kettle of fish altogther, as an attack on a NATO country is an attack on all NATO countries. I love Estonia too. I have some Estonian friends and would love to see Tailinn one day. It's supposed to be spectacular.

[Zipperfish]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Look how easily that phrase can be turned.

No insult intended, my point is that the US made a promise and Obama's broken it. Why not break any other promise?

In any case, it's not the fault of the Ukrainians that they haven't defended themselves from their one-time partner, Russia, any more than it is Canada's fault for not defending itself from the USA.

This time last year the notion of Russia invading Ukraine was as ludicrous as the US invading Canada. Again, no offense, but you probably would've mocked anyone who even suggested the idea of Russia invading Ukraine and anschlussing Crimea as being paranoid.

On an aside, this is a fine place to note that it was Sarah Palin back in 2008 who said that Russia would invade Ukraine if Obama took the White House.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelpeck ... t-ukraine/

$1:

“After the Russian Army invaded the nation of Georgia, Senator Obama’s reaction was one of indecision and moral equivalence, the kind of response that would only encourage Russia’s Putin to invade Ukraine next,” Palin claimed in 2008, during her vice-presidential bid alongside John McCain.

Palin, already mocked for claiming that she could see Russia from Alaska, was criticized for her Ukraine prediction. Among the critics was Foreign Policy Magazine, which described her forecast as “strange” and an “an extremely far-fetched scenario.”

I quoted the second paragraph to underline my point that the idea that Ukraine needed to arm itself against Russia would've been derided as 'strange' and 'extremely far-fetched'.

And Ukraine's actions prior to this debacle were then quite rational based on the best information available.

Yes I could have phrased it better. Obama hasn't been very good. I just think the ease with which Russia took Crimea added to the Russian propaganda line that it was kind of theirs anyway.

Good find on Palin.