[Thanos]

Robair Robair:

Thanos Thanos:

How about the democracy that the CWB cared so much about when they had farmers who wanted to sell their own grain thrown into jail?

When that happened, the federal government was in control of the board. Now the board is elected by farmers. This board election is what Harper has been messing with. And he's had his hands slapped in court for it a couple of times for good reason too.

If you want to get into a conversation on the kinds of crap Harper has been pulling with the CWB, look up any one of my threads on the topic. But it sounds like you need to get current if you're still talking about jailed farmers, a lot has happened since then.

Once a Liberal/NDP/Marxist Bloc so into eternity. Do you really think that anything that's been done to protect independent farmers or small businesses will survive a Liberal government that's beholden to the NDP and Bloc? This anti-democracy that's started over the last few days could signal a descent in the excesses of far-leftist nonsense that'll make what Trudeau did look sensible in comparison.

[DerbyX]

Thanos Thanos:

You negate my vote in an election and then expect me to sit back in silence and just take it? You get down on your knees and start blowing away to the pleasure of a separatist party that wants to destroy our country?

The Liberals arrogance knows no boundaries. You bastards wanted war, you got one.

Harper didn't mind cozing up to the seperatists when it served him.

You and your arrogant bastard Harper tried to bully the opposition. Did you expect them to just sit back and take it?

He had the chance before last election to try and work with one party for support and didn't.

He has another chance to try and work with one of the other parties and instead he is choosing to act like a bully and dare the opposition to topple him.

He got exactly what he deserves.

[Robair]

Harper is a coward.

[mtbr]

Robair Robair:

Harper is a coward.

oh really ...Liberals have never done that before
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/s ... TopStories

"Liberals made a sudden move to control the timing of a possible election, by restricting when the opposition will be able to introduce a motion that could possibly topple the minority government.

Liberals accused Conservatives of trying to "hijack" the legislative agenda, while Conservative leader Stephen Harper said the government is on a "death watch."

[Freakinoldguy]

This whole scenario smacks of Russia in 1917 where the Bolsheviks formed alliances with other parties in order to topple the ruling party. But the best part of the whole scenario was, that, when they had attained power they eliminated their erstwhile allies........literally not figuratively.

If the other parties go along with this whole Liberal planned coup, I wish them luck, because once the Liberals are in............ they're out, whether they think so or not.

So as a premeptive coutesy, I'd just like to say goodbye to the three unwise men, (okay, two unwise men and a whinning harpie) Taliban Jack, Gilles Duceppe, and Elizabeth May.

[kenmore]

A coalition would be a good idea right now...the torys have no real plan to help the current crises except screw the little guy and they never had a plan before the election.. so ya turf em out!

[kenmore]

ridenrain ridenrain:

Obviously these Liberals feel they are entitled to that public money and will go to any desperate lengths to get it.
I wonder how Dion/Martin and Latyon feel about being left out of the loop on this deal?

The torys have been taking it for years.. political bull crap is what this is..
if the libs, or NDP were in power and came up with this you would by singing a different tune... hope the othes form a coalition and boot that ass hole.

[kenmore]

mtbr mtbr:

I wonder what Bob Rae and his supporters are thinking today

Je ne comprends pas anglais

[StuntmanMike]

DerbyX DerbyX:

Harper didn't mind cozing up to the seperatists when it served him.

You and your arrogant bastard Harper tried to bully the opposition. Did you expect them to just sit back and take it?

He had the chance before last election to try and work with one party for support and didn't.

He has another chance to try and work with one of the other parties and instead he is choosing to act like a bully and dare the opposition to topple him.

He got exactly what he deserves.

I think that pretty much sums it up. When this began, I thought it was another brilliant end-run around the Libs by Harper. But it now looks like he bit off more than he can chew, and he's had the effect of galvanizing the opposition against him.

Really though, you're a little naive to suggest this has anything to do with political principals or giving "the left" a voice. It's happening because the Libs don't have much choice. If they allow him to cut their funding, then the Libs and Bloc are finished. The NDP could survive, because they have a strong, grassroots, fundraising base. But Layton is capitalizing on this crisis to gain power in a coalition government with the Libs. Situations like this are what the NDP live for, and they only occur about once every 3 decades.

[StuntmanMike]

kenmore kenmore:

A coalition would be a good idea right now...the torys have no real plan to help the current crises except screw the little guy and they never had a plan before the election.. so ya turf em out!

I think their plan was actually pretty solid. Apart from the removal of election subsidies for parties. That was blatantly partisan, and that's what set the opposition on a war footing.

Other than that though, I think reigning in spending, freezing government salaries and the other austerity measures are a very sensible response to the current economic crisis.

It's too early to start handing out billions. The market hasn't even settled yet and we haven't seen what Obama's response will be south of the border. Waiting to see where an economic stimulus plan can do the most good, while cutting back on the perks in the meantime, is a very sensible response in my opinion.

[DerbyX]

StuntmanMike StuntmanMike:

I think that pretty much sums it up. When this began, I thought it was another brilliant end-run around the Libs by Harper. But it now looks like he bit off more than he can chew, and he's had the effect of galvanizing the opposition against him.

Its good that you see it. Now despite your opinion of me you are too new to remember the days when I touted the Liberals and CPC working togeather as the 2 parties reprsesenting the most Canadians. This was before and after Harpers win in 06. The Libs were fiscally sound and comitted to paying down the debt and I thought harper was as well. I figured the 2 parties could trade off social compromises like the Libs dropping gun control measures and the CPC dropping attempts to curtail SSM and abortion. Martin was already spending big on the military so both parties were lock in step in that regards. Constantly being berated for not considering the Liberals/Chretien/Martin as the worst criminals since pretty boy floyd by blind con hacks like RR and the continued miscues, misteps and downright hypocracy of Harper has pushed me firmly into the Lib-NDP-Green camp.

Lets face it. Harper has had 3 chances to win. 1 loss, 1 bare minority against a weakened Liberal party and another minority against a decimated and divided 3 party vote splitting opposition.

Were I a con I'd be looking in Peter Mackays direction right about now, especialy considering that Harper stands a good chance at being toppled by a coalition government that more then anybody he helped create.

StuntmanMike StuntmanMike:

Really though, you're a little naive to suggest this has anything to do with political principals or giving "the left" a voice. It's happening because the Libs don't have much choice. If they allow him to cut their funding, then the Libs and Bloc are finished. The NDP could survive, because they have a strong, grassroots, fundraising base. But Layton is capitalizing on this crisis to gain power in a coalition government with the Libs. Situations like this are what the NDP live for, and they only occur about once every 3 decades.

The voice thing was rhetoric countering other rhetoric. Of course the coalition is about politics and defeating Harper just as the unite the right movement. It may win or lose but right now the "left" vote is split between 3 parties. While the greens didn't win a seat they garnered an impressive amount of votes and in their absence would likely have swung more then a few seats to the Libs and NDP. I highly doubt anyone voting green had the CPC as their backup choice.

While the NDP may feel they hold the balance they should come back to reality. At Laytons strongest showing yet and a weak Liberal party giving them votes he came nowhere near forming the official opposition as some had thought and/or hoped. In true Canadian fashion he did not even medal coming in 4th place.

His NDP party very realistically runs the risk of bleeding all those votes back to the Libs as people realize that if they want a left swinging govt then they need to vote Liberal to defeat the CPC in at least a minority fashion.

When its all said and done, Harper has done a piss-poor job over the last year or so and every step of the way doing things he decried the Liberals did. Chretiens helo cancellation is still cried about yet try getting the cons to admit Harpers cancellation of the JSS, icebreakers, northern bases, SAR aircraft, etc is just as bad.

Chretien was vilified for partisan politics and opportunistic elections by people here still bitching about it. What they really mean to say is that they don't hate what Chrettien was doing but rather that it was he doing it. Look at the people crowing as Harper does exactly what they hated the Liberals for.

In the end Harper had the chance to be a leader, the kind of leader that decides the country comes first and the voters will should be followed. His first legislation of the new term and he has us either facing a new election in short order or else being toppled unilaterially by a coalition govt.

Thats not leadership.

[Thanos]

I knew that Liberals and NDP's were pathetic before but this thread really seals it. Do any of them realize that the only thing that's guaranteed to happen is that they're going to have to suck Bloc Quebecois cock in order to make this joke of a power grab work? That's how low they've sunk, they're bending over and at the same time providing the free lubrication for a bunch of traitorous separatist slime to take over the entire country? Is that what power is really worth to these kind of people? What it it, 77 Liberal seats and 37 NDP ones? 114 out of 305 give them a right to govern, to subvert an election's results and literally negate the votes of practically everyone who voted on Oct 14 2008. Stephane Dion was rejected as Prime Minister. Jack Layton was rejected as Prime Minister. The Green Shift was rejected. The higher taxes the NDP wanted were rejected.

But the leftist mind says screw the electoral process. We know better than the voters so we're going to subvert a democratic election result in order to get out way and advance the ideology. And the Bloc separatism, the foundational principle of their evil party, doesn't matter any more, does it? We're all just big wonderful leftist brothers now, aren't we and making a party that wants to destroy Canada into the kingmaker and the lynchpin that holds this entire disgusting scam together is just the price that the Canadian people are going to have to pay, isn't it? Screw you, Canada , we know better than all you commoners do and we'll take the power any fucking way we want to.

Disgusting, absolutely fucking disgusting. The Liberals and NDP's have shown that they'll slither and slime on their bellies with the worst that's out there just to get the political and financial power that the election denied to them. "Fascist" is too good a label to use for these types of filth. As far as I'm concerned they ought to be put up against the wall right next to the Bloc and treated the way that all traitors deserve. No good sons of bitches!

[StuntmanMike]

$1:

Its good that you see it. Now despite your opinion of me you are too new to remember the days when I touted the Liberals and CPC working togeather as the 2 parties reprsesenting the most Canadians.

I have no "opinion" of you one way or the other. I don't even know you. You're some guy somewhere in Canada who posts about politics on an obscure website. Same as me. Let's not make this personal.

$1:

Harper has pushed me firmly into the Lib-NDP-Green camp.

We differ here. I'm not in any "camp." While I enjoy watching the cut and thrust of the political game, it's not like following a hockey team. I change my loyalties according to the issues and the circumstances. At the moment, I think the Conservatives are the best equipped to govern with the best plan. But the Libs have been in that position before, and may be again.

$1:

Were I a con I'd be looking in Peter Mackays direction right about now,

I wouldn't. I think Mckay is a fool. He was immature when he cried on TV during the Belinda debacle, and was a complete embarrassment when he gushed like a schoolgirl and declared himself a "fan" of Condeleeza Rice during her visit last year.

$1:

The voice thing was rhetoric countering other rhetoric. Of course the coalition is about politics and defeating Harper just as the unite the right movement.

Fair enough. Initially, I got the impression you were a bit of a kool-aid drinker, but rhetorical debate is part of the game in both the political process and on boards like this.

But personally, I'm not one to engage in it.

$1:

While the NDP may feel they hold the balance they should come back to reality. At Laytons strongest showing yet and a weak Liberal party giving them votes he came nowhere near forming the official opposition as some had thought and/or hoped. In true Canadian fashion he did not even medal coming in 4th place.

That may be the case, but right now, Mike Duffy is reporting that the NDP is asking the Libs for 5-6 seats in cabinet in exchange for their support. They initially were demanding the high-profile position of finance minister, if you can believe it! That's not likely to happen at this stage, but they will probably get industry, and some other choice jobs.

That's an awful lot of influence for a party that "didn't even medal" as you say.

$1:

When its all said and done, Harper has done a piss-poor job over the last year or so and every step of the way doing things he decried the Liberals did. Chretiens helo cancellation is still cried about yet try getting the cons to admit Harpers cancellation of the JSS, icebreakers, northern bases, SAR aircraft, etc is just as bad.

I think, all things considered, he's run a fairly decent government. I think the GST cuts were a mistake, but apart from that, I don't have many problems with anything he's done.

$1:

In the end Harper had the chance to be a leader, the kind of leader that decides the country comes first and the voters will should be followed. His first legislation of the new term and he has us either facing a new election in short order or else being toppled unilaterially by a coalition govt.

Thats not leadership.

You've got a point here. While I agree with most of the principals of the economic statement, his decision to kick the opposition parties in the teeth by cutting off election financing was partisan and divisive. He believed the opposition would cave, and now at this stage, it looks like they've rallied and are going to try and bring him down.

A constitutional crisis is not what Canada needs during these uncertain times, and Harper is responsible for causing it.

[westmanguy]

I started a facebook movement against the Lib/NDP coalition gov't!

[djakeydd]

StuntmanMike StuntmanMike:

DerbyX DerbyX:

Harper didn't mind cozing up to the seperatists when it served him.

You and your arrogant bastard Harper tried to bully the opposition. Did you expect them to just sit back and take it?

He had the chance before last election to try and work with one party for support and didn't.

He has another chance to try and work with one of the other parties and instead he is choosing to act like a bully and dare the opposition to topple him.

He got exactly what he deserves.

I think that pretty much sums it up. When this began, I thought it was another brilliant end-run around the Libs by Harper. But it now looks like he bit off more than he can chew, and he's had the effect of galvanizing the opposition against him.

Can't argue with you here stuntman. Harper's arrogance and hubris is gonna bite him on the ass, and as you say, this has finally galvanized the three other parties against him. Kick the pcs bums out, good riddance to very bad rubbish.

Really though, you're a little naive to suggest this has anything to do with political principals or giving "the left" a voice. It's happening because the Libs don't have much choice. If they allow him to cut their funding, then the Libs and Bloc are finished. The NDP could survive, because they have a strong, grassroots, fundraising base. But Layton is capitalizing on this crisis to gain power in a coalition government with the Libs. Situations like this are what the NDP live for, and they only occur about once every 3 decades.

I cannot argue with you stuntman. Harper's arrogance and hubris has galvanized the opposition against him, and it is past time the bum was shown the exit, hopefully his rump reformers will fall off the map with him.