[Curtman]

FieryVulpine FieryVulpine:

Simple. Because I have an inkling that they wouldn't be half as loud if it were Iggy and the Liberals doing it.

The Liberals are doing it? Considering when the group started, the Liberals, NDP, and Conservatives wouldn't talk to us, only the Green party was in from day one. Now it's only the Conservatives who ignore us. Even the Minister of Democratic Reform won't answer his email.

You can try to claim it's the Green's doing it, but you'd be wrong there as well. It's mostly everyone except the Conservatives now, but even they are welcome to join.

[PublicAnimalNo9]

kenmore kenmore:

Lets not forget that it is the party in power that is responsible for sending aid to Haiti. If the libs were in power they would have done it sooner..
but they are not and lets not lessen the heat on the torys over prorogation and putting their personal, selfish interest ahead of Canadians and the running of the country.. for me I will be attending one of the rallys they are holding across the country to show displeasure with this autoctratic fool.

THis isn't to call you out Kenmore cuz yer not the only person to say something similar but, could someone PLEASE tell me of ANY politician of any stripe that doesn't work for their own self-interest???
Here's an example of what I mean. A while back, Iggy said he was being quiet about a platform because the Tories already stole a couple of his ideas. Now, the question is, why should Iggy care? If it's something that is of benefit to the country, then he should be satisfied that it was implemented, IF he actually gave a shit about Canada. A good idea is a good idea, no matter who comes up with it. Likewise for shitty ideas.
There is not one politician with any sort of power that isn't working towards their own self-interest, to the detriment of the country.
And calling Harper an autocrat is simple hypocracy when our entire parliamentary system is autocratic. Parties from BOTH sides have abused the system for years now. The corruption and laissez-faire attitudes from Trudeau, Mulroney ,Chretien and Harper are destroying this once great nation.
No sir, what we have in Canada are democratically elected dictatorships in a system that almost seems custom made for abuse while giving the illusion of democracy.
And neither Cons or Libs are immune to it.

[FieryVulpine]

Curtman Curtman:

The Liberals are doing it? Considering when the group started, the Liberals, NDP, and Conservatives wouldn't talk to us, only the Green party was in from day one. Now it's only the Conservatives who ignore us. Even the Minister of Democratic Reform won't answer his email.

You can try to claim it's the Green's doing it, but you'd be wrong there as well. It's mostly everyone except the Conservatives now, but even they are welcome to join.

Maybe you didn't read the part where I said "if". My assertion is that these are the kind of people are the ones who would give the Liberals a free pass to abuse the system any way they choose.

[EyeBrock]

Empty vessels make most noise.

[ShepherdsDog]

Sinking ones are pretty noisy too

[Curtman]

FieryVulpine FieryVulpine:

Maybe you didn't read the part where I said "if". My assertion is that these are the kind of people are the ones who would give the Liberals a free pass to abuse the system any way they choose.

It makes no difference who is in charge. The point of the group is to get a bill through the house to take away the power of the Prime Minister alone to make a decision to prorogue. It should be put to a free vote in the house of commons if they want to prorogue. The NDP has plans to introduce this legislation.

This bill doesn't affect only the Conservatives, it will prevent minority governments of any colour from proroguing to avoid answering to the opposition.

Now what were you saying about the Liberals getting a free pass?

[EyeBrock]

So your group is drafting a Bill eh curtman?

I was thinking of doing the same, or maybe becoming an astronaut.

[Scape]

Might as well, all the cool kids are doing it.

The real problem here is that a minority is such a rare animal in Canada that fundamental issues like these are never dealt with so it prone to be abused. A Prorogue in this fashion should trigger a confidence motion so that the PM can still do it but with consequence. However, then you have the PM being held hostage by the opposition. Still, we should not encourage this sort of procedure as a matter of habit. In which case the only self correcting measure is the polls giving the government in power a clear reminder of their mandate. The people are upset and they should make it clear that this is not a power to be used frivolously as it has been so far.

[Curtman]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

So your group is drafting a Bill eh curtman?

I was thinking of doing the same, or maybe becoming an astronaut.

The NDP is, and they will introduce it. Now the group has to make sure the Libs, and the Bloc will vote for it.

If 210,000 Canadians hadn't joined together to make this an issue, nobody would be doing anything about it.

[EyeBrock]

It's also good to see that 4,000,000 people in the US and Canada have got together about the joys of Nutella.

Without them that spread would just not be taken as seriously.

[Curtman]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

It's also good to see that 4,000,000 people in the US and Canada have got together about the joys of Nutella.

Without them that spread would just not be taken as seriously.

Are they contacting their elected representatives and holding them accountable for something? No? Has Nutella's competition gone down 15% in recent polls?

Hrmm. Not really the same then is it?

[EyeBrock]

No, Nutella have FOUR MILLION people joining the FB page. You guys have a paltry 210,000 in a country of 30,000,000. That's .007 % of the population.

An outraged .007 %?

I think Nutella got you beat.

[Zipperfish]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

No, Nutella have FOUR MILLION people joining the FB page. You guys have a paltry 210,000 in a country of 30,000,000. That's .007 % of the population.

An outraged .007 %?

I think Nutella got you beat.

0.7% actually. Sorry, I'm a math geek.

That's a pretty appreciable number, but then joining a FB group is pretty easy. One click. One test will be tomorrow--how many people show up to the protests. And another test will be the polls. And the ultimate test will be the election.

[bootlegga]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

It's also good to see that 4,000,000 people in the US and Canada have got together about the joys of Nutella.

Without them that spread would just not be taken as seriously.

I'll say to that what I said to gigs, comparing a Nutella group to a prorogue group means squat and is a case fo apples and oranges.

Nutella (or the silly examples Gigs used) are groups aimed at wide, cross-national markets, whereas the prorogue group isn't. It's aimed at Canadian Facebook fans, and while others from outside Canada might have joined, it's highly unlikely that the majority are from outside Canada, whereas I'd be willing to bet dollars to donuts that there are far more Nutella fans from OUTSIDE Canada than from inside (just based on the numbers of Canadian and US Facebook users).

A similar argument is like me saying well, the Conservatives have 10,000 fans and Nutella has 4,00,000, so obviously Nutella is vastly more legitimate than the Conservative Party. Of course, that's not true either.

Even comparing Canadian political groups isn't really relevant. I can compare the Conservatives with the prorogue group, and by virtue of 10,000 versus 210,000, prorogue wins the day, doesn't it? Of course not.

No, the only real test is as Zip said, how many show up tomorrow for the protests across the country. My guess is it won't be close to 200,000 (even if you add up every person in every protest nationwide), but I think the 35 person mid week protest will easily be eclipsed.

No, if I was Harper, I'd be more worried about the 15% drop he's suffered in the past few weeks. It's gonna take a pretty big screw-up by Iggy and company to get him back into majority territory when Parliament resumes.

[2Cdo]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

And the ultimate test will be the election.

Which isn't happening anytime soon.