[Gunnair]

DerbyX DerbyX:

Not sure what grounds the profs can object to scholarships. Scholarships are based on any number of criteria. They are most often private funds and can be very specific such as requiring the recipient to be of a specific religion and attending a specific program. Anybody can set up a scholarship if they want since it basically amounts to a private citizen giving money to a student.

Agreed. It seems to be simply a knee-jerk reaction, as I certainly have not read anywhere anything that I would opine as a reasonable reason to cease these scholarships. If we have no good reason to oppose some no neck grade five level literati to have a sports scholarship, why should anyone oppose helping send someone to school whose parent was killed in the line of duty? I would think the point was to educate people?

Maybe not.

[Scape]

I think I understand what they are driving at here. Ultimately project Hero is a form of worship and that's what they have issue with. It's not the project itself that is seen as repulsive but rather the cover it provides for the cheer leading of nationalism. If we give preferential treatment to this cause then who is to stop the blood of hero's to become cheap currency in other causes as well? I just think that the watchword here is vigilance, yes if we bestow special status to troops family's now there is a possibility of others riding the laurels that no one can contest. The fact that this goes without saying seems to be taken for granted by some but should not be ignored out of hand.

I still think the project is a worthy effort.

[EyeBrock]

Gunnair Gunnair:

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

I didn't say I was opposed to them having the right to say what they thought if you notice Gunnair.

They could air their views unlike Coulter or Jewish students at York.

There are two levels of free speech it would appear. That alludes to something rotten in our universities.

I did notice, though apparently not what you wanted me to, hence my post.

Certainly the fact you are complaining about what the profs said suggests you are opposed to it, otherwise one would think you'd be giving them a big thumbs up and thanking them for airing their educated opinion to the rest of us then politely refuting it with opinion.

Or not. Hard to tell tone on forums...

True, no tone though. I just think that if we believe in free speech it should be applied equally.

Jewish students shouldn't be chased off campus because some people don't dig Israel.

Silly cows like Coulter shouldn't face a mob agitated by faculty censors.

Kids of dead soldiers deserve free education.

Free speech! Not censors driven by 'human rights' or the likes.

[Gunnair]

Scape Scape:

I think I understand what they are driving at here. Ultimately project Hero is a form of worship and that's what they have issue with. It's not the project itself that is seen as repulsive but rather the cover it provides for the cheer leading of nationalism. If we give preferential treatment to this cause then who is to stop the blood of hero's to become cheap currency in other causes as well? I just think that the watchword here is vigilance, yes if we bestow special status to troops family's now there is a possibility of others riding the laurels that no one can contest. The fact that this goes without saying seems to be taken for granted by some but should not be ignored out of hand.

I still think the project is a worthy effort.

Cannot the same be said of sports scholorships? We give preferential treatment to those skilled in particular sports over others who are not, which can also be looked upon as form of worship.

I'm not terribly worried about others hopping onto the laurels. People are generally pretty vigilant about that and will pounce on anything smelling funny.

[Scape]

Not the same, even sport scholarship means there is personal investment. This would be an inheritance and a perk bestowed that other Canadians would not have access to.

I agree about the optics being picked up on by the public but populism has a weird way of lulling people to sleep.

[EyeBrock]

Scape Scape:

Not the same, even sport scholarship means there is personal investment. This would be an inheritance and a perk bestowed that other Canadians would not have access to.

I agree about the optics being picked up on by the public but populism has a weird way of lulling people to sleep.

Don't First Nations kids get free education?

[Scape]

I'm no expert but isn't that a part of the Indian Act? There is nothing about scholarships for familys in the QR&O as I recall.

[Meadowlark]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

Don't First Nations kids get free education?

Should they though or really anyone? Or should education be an individual responsibility?

[Gunnair]

Scape Scape:

Not the same, even sport scholarship means there is personal investment. This would be an inheritance and a perk bestowed that other Canadians would not have access to.

I agree about the optics being picked up on by the public but populism has a weird way of lulling people to sleep.

There's a lot of personal investment by a family to send someone off to war. There's even more when they come back in a casket.

I guess one can look at it as a perk that other Canadians don't have access to. But why would they want access to it? That perk would cost them a member of their family.

[Scape]

That part and parcel with signing on the dotted line. They have the option to stay on civi street and get a higher paying job (lord knows they are out there) and put their skills to more profitable endeavors but they made a conscious choice of their own volition to serve their country instead.

It's that same freedom to make that choice that defends these 16 profs from saying their families should not be getting scholarships in their name because essentially that is what we are doing by defacto. People look 'unCanadian' by not supporting such a program by default and its that peer pressure that veils the evils of nationalism because no one can call them on it without being labeled a traitor. This puts more value on one citizen that chooses to serve his vocation in the Army then one that plies his trade as a carpenter making the city hall and we shouldn't be playing favorites like that as it cheapens what it means to be a citizen in a free society that is Canada for all of us.

[Scape]

Meadowlark Meadowlark:

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

Don't First Nations kids get free education?

Should they though or really anyone? Or should education be an individual responsibility?

http://www.macdonaldlaurier.ca/

Free to Learn: Giving Aboriginal Youth Control over Their Post-Secondary Education

[EyeBrock]

Scape Scape:

That part and parcel with signing on the dotted line. They have the option to stay on civi street and get a higher paying job (lord knows they are out there) and put their skills to more profitable endeavors but they made a conscious choice of their own volition to serve their country instead.

It's that same freedom to make that choice that defends these 16 profs from saying their families should not be getting scholarships in their name because essentially that is what we are doing by defacto. People look 'unCanadian' by not supporting such a program by default and its that peer pressure that veils the evils of nationalism because no one can call them on it without being labeled a traitor. This puts more value on one citizen that chooses to serve his vocation in the Army then one that plies his trade as a carpenter making the city hall and we shouldn't be playing favorites like that as it cheapens what it means to be a citizen in a free society that is Canada for all of us.

They have the option to stay on civvie street and get a higher paying job? Really?

Tell that to most of the guys who are from rural Canada Scape. The CF is much like the Brit military.
Most join to get out of where they are from. It's true a chunk follow in family footsteps but you have served. You know the score, why did you join up? I joined straight from school to get out of the public housing projects of Manchester.

Esprit-de-corps came later.

And as an 'ex' CF guy I'm kinda suprised that you even give these 16 profs opinions the time of day really. They have no clue about those that have signed the dotted line, nor do they seem to care.

[Scape]

Absolutely, especially in the support trades when the demand is higher on the civi side and the wages reflect that. I have a friend of mine who was a sig expert in networking and they pay him 5 times what the military contract was offering him. Works for EDS now after being RCR for 20 years.

Now, he's not a grunt but he started as one and got a trade while he was in and wanted to stay but the military just would not offer a reasonable salary as compared to the offers he was getting. A lot of brain drain in the ranks simply because the paymaster will not be allowed to offer contracts but we can train them on the public coin and they end up being scouted by private firms.

As for myself I joined when I was 16 but basic didn't start till a week after my birthday so they squeezed me in. I stayed 11 years as 031 before working for a private firm that contracts for the crown instead.

I bear no malice towards the 16 just as they have none for me for wearing green. I just understand what it is they are trying to say but its an emotional issue for most, wrapped up in patriotism and all that. I've been there, done that and I would like to think that I did my bit so that they could live in a country that they could have there say without fear of reprisal. I wish them luck but I don't support the cause because I think private initiatives to support families as long as its a voluntary is above board in my books. I can see why they speak out but if that's the worst of their concerns then I'd say we are lucky to have such trivial concerns in this great country of ours.