[PublicAnimalNo9]

llama66 llama66:

I don't like him either, but to equate declaring "Housing as a Right" to the road to Tyranny and Dictatorship is laughable.

It may be but the mechanism Groper is using is not laughable. I mean, for a guy who screamed blue bloody murder about Harper's omnibus bills this is now what, the 2nd Groper omnibus bill in less than a year?

By the way, even dictators can come up with shit that sounds good.
Unfortunately, Groper's ideology has left him blinded to the housing problem. At an intake of now roughly 400,000 immigrants and refugees every year, if you're going to declare housing as a right, you better make sure the goddam construction industry (that he shit all over) is up to the task of building an additional roughly 100,000 affordable housing units each year.

Canada: We have a serious affordable housing crisis.

Groper: Well we need to increase immigration to almost 400,000/yr right away then.

Canada: How does that help alleviate the problem?

Groper: Don't worry, I'll make housing a right in an omnibus bill.

Canada: Can't we just reduce immigration numbers instead and save ourselves the money and hassle?

Groper: That's un-Canadian and that kind of talk is the politics of division. But don't worry about the money, budgets balance themselves.

[herbie]

$1:

What's funny is that while it's underhanded to sneak things into Omnibus Bills we're all waiting to hear the case against the right to housing.

Well trolling works, you sure took the bait!

[peck420]

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

At an intake of now roughly 400,000 immigrants and refugees every year, if you're going to declare housing as a right, you better make sure the goddam construction industry (that he shit all over) is up to the task of building an additional roughly 100,000 affordable housing units each year.

Canadian construction industry is more than up to the task.

Building codes and banks, however, are not.

[N_Fiddledog]

herbie herbie:

$1:

What's funny is that while it's underhanded to sneak things into Omnibus Bills we're all waiting to hear the case against the right to housing.

Well trolling works, you sure took the bait,

he trolled.

[N_Fiddledog]

I think it's important to realize that when he talks about a "human right to housing" he's not talking about the Canadians livings in alleys and under bridges.

He's talking about this:

$1:

Characterizing housing as a human right is meant to provide recourse, usually through tribunals, to anyone wrongfully denied a home for reasons such as ethnicity, religion, or gender identity, and put pressure on the federal government to help make the right a reality.

Also this seems to be more about providing more power to the kangaroo courts managing what progressives call "human rights councils."

[DrCaleb]

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

Just wondering where the outrage from the people who had complete melt downs when Harper pushed his ominbus bills through is?

They left the board because of all the racism, bigotry and hate that floats around here now.

You're kidding me right?

Not even a little. Every member who has made the decision to leave and never return, who also took the time to say 'goodbye', has cited the hostile and bigoted tone around here as a major factor in their decision. There are other factors, but that is the common one.

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

Because, I haven't been called all that many disgusting and less than flattering names since most of these supposed paragons of virtue left. So, I hate to break it to you but, if they left because of all the racism, bigotry and hate, they left because they were part of the problem.

Not by me. And not by ZipperFish, or Regina, or ShepherdsDog, or Lemmy . . . none of the moderates who used to frequent here has called you names since they left.

We all knew this would happen when Streaker, Lilly and that crowd got banned just for existing; that their opposition would have free reign. And that's what's happened. So CKA is a reflection of the people who frequent it. Shitposts and all. The Lefties that remain have become so frustrated by all the trolling that they end up getting nasty once in a while. and it's up to the Moderators to tone it down.

A pointless effort, in my eyes.

[llama66]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

llama66 llama66:

I have the right to live in your house and eat all of Mrs. Bart's burgers.

You may not have a right to do that but you're certainly welcome to!

Yay! Victory!

[bootlegga]

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

Just wondering where the outrage from the people who had complete melt downs when Harper pushed his ominbus bills through is?

It was wrong for any party to use, no matter who their leader is.

But it's always interesting when opposition parties find omnibus bills an attack on democracy, but once they get into office, they use them too. I've little doubt that if Scheer wins in October, his party will use them just like his predecessors have.

[Freakinoldguy]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Not by me. And not by ZipperFish, or Regina, or ShepherdsDog, or Lemmy . . . none of the moderates who used to frequent here has called you names since they left.

We all knew this would happen when Streaker, Lilly and that crowd got banned just for existing; that their opposition would have free reign. And that's what's happened. So CKA is a reflection of the people who frequent it. Shitposts and all. The Lefties that remain have become so frustrated by all the trolling that they end up getting nasty once in a while. and it's up to the Moderators to tone it down.

A pointless effort, in my eyes.

That may be true and in all honesty I'm sad to see most of those people go. But by the same token I was sad to people on the right go to because I enjoyed their arguments about relevant topics since it gave me insight into things I'd never thought of. But, why do you assume it's mostly people on the "left" who've departed because of the toxic atmosphere of this board? Just look at the members list and you can see that it's been people of every political stripe who've walked away and just because they didn't pm you or another admin and blame it on the right doesn't mean they didn't leave for the same reasons. So, claiming it's because of the "righties" trolling might not be accurate, especially from what I saw in my early years on here.

Besides, there have been a myriad of others that are no longer here who liked to "troll" name call and give people grief when they couldn't win an argument and guess what? They weren't all "right wing". So, why do you say it's only people on the "left" who get frustrated and become nasty when they think they're being trolled. If trolling's the criteria for someone to use insulting and demeaning language towards another poster then it should come as no surprise that people of both political persuasions do the exact same thing. I've seen people both right and left get frustrated and lash out which is one reason I swore I wouldn't say anything to anyone on here that I wouldn't say to their face. And for the record, I can only remember one instance where I broken my own rule and responded to someone who called me an "idiot" with another insult.

Unfortunately trolling happens to pretty much everyone at some point or another and in the 12 years that I've been on here I've seen just as many "lefties" trolling as I have righties" especially during the "Harper must die years". So, IMO there is no difference between the "left and the right" when it comes to trolling and people would be better served if they remembered that, just because you're losing an argument, it doesn't necessarily mean that you're being trolled.

But, since you seem to think this forum always was or has degenerated into nothing more than a platform for "right wing trolls" to abuse anyone on the "left" with impunity, allow me to ask. Why did you become an administrator and why do you remain an administrator especially when, you appear to have such little respect for a fairly large portion of the current membership based on their political leanings?

[martin14]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Every member who has made the decision to leave and never return, who also took the time to say 'goodbye', has cited the hostile and bigoted tone around here as a major factor in their decision.

I have never seen any of these 'goodbye' letters, must be a secret or something.

$1:

Not by me. And not by ZipperFish, or Regina, or ShepherdsDog, or Lemmy . . . none of the moderates who used to frequent here has called you names since they left.

The only moderate on that list is Regina.

$1:

We all knew this would happen when Streaker, Lilly and that crowd got banned just for existing;

No, they were groupbanned for being members of the supersecret Facebook Group.
Nothing more, but more than existing. How easy the 'misinterpretations' flow.

$1:

A pointless effort, in my eyes.

I really should comment on this, but I won't.

[Freakinoldguy]

bootlegga bootlegga:

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

Just wondering where the outrage from the people who had complete melt downs when Harper pushed his ominbus bills through is?

It was wrong for any party to use, no matter who their leader is.

But it's always interesting when opposition parties find omnibus bills an attack on democracy, but once they get into office, they use them too. I've little doubt that if Scheer wins in October, his party will use them just like his predecessors have.

Exactly. The more they change the more they stay the same and that's what scares me about this attempt to subvert the rights of succeeding gov'ts. If Trudeau get's away with it, how long will it take till the Conservatives do the exact same thing only it won't be one bill it'll be two or three and so on and so forth till we have no need of politicians anymore since every facet of gov't will be written in unchangeable bills.

[DrCaleb]

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Not by me. And not by ZipperFish, or Regina, or ShepherdsDog, or Lemmy . . . none of the moderates who used to frequent here has called you names since they left.

We all knew this would happen when Streaker, Lilly and that crowd got banned just for existing; that their opposition would have free reign. And that's what's happened. So CKA is a reflection of the people who frequent it. Shitposts and all. The Lefties that remain have become so frustrated by all the trolling that they end up getting nasty once in a while. and it's up to the Moderators to tone it down.

A pointless effort, in my eyes.

But, why do you assume it's mostly people on the "left" who've departed because of the toxic atmosphere of this board?

...

So, why do you say it's only people on the "left" who get frustrated and become nasty when they think they're being trolled.

I've never written any such thing. Above, I simply state that the views on this board tipped to the right, when the annoying left got banned. And they have remained right leaning since.

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

But, since you seem to think this forum always was or has degenerated into nothing more than a platform for "right wing trolls" to abuse anyone on the "left" with impunity,

Again, I've never written that. Trolling can come from either side.

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

allow me to ask. Why did you become an administrator and why do you remain an administrator especially when, you appear to have such little respect for a fairly large portion of the current membership based on their political leanings?

Firstly, I didn't ask to become a moderator. (I'm not an administrator). I was nominated, and accepted.

If I didn't have any respect for the views of others, this board would be vastly different than the way I see it right now. As I've written many times, quoting another, 'the only true free speech is that which you detest'. If I didn't respect the views of others, every divisive thread on this board would find it's way to "The Flaming Dumpster". Every person starting a thread with the sole intent of dividing us, would be gone. But I am not in charge. I am but a 'referee'.

I remain a moderator because I am perfectly capable of distinguishing between the rules as they are written, and my own opinions. And because moderation is the only thing keeping this board somewhat readable. I think it can still be salvaged, but it has to hit rock bottom first. When the haters start eating their own, my mission will be complete.

Free speech also works both ways. I am enjoying my new role in pointing out the fallacies posters use in their arguments, and making sure CKA is not a safe space for the hate.

[DrCaleb]

martin14 martin14:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Every member who has made the decision to leave and never return, who also took the time to say 'goodbye', has cited the hostile and bigoted tone around here as a major factor in their decision.

I have never seen any of these 'goodbye' letters, must be a secret or something.

Perhaps you should take that as a hint. Also 'goodbye' threads are specifically against the rules.

Here's one that you can read:

http://www.canadaka.net/profiles/DrCaleb/

martin14 martin14:

$1:

Not by me. And not by ZipperFish, or Regina, or ShepherdsDog, or Lemmy . . . none of the moderates who used to frequent here has called you names since they left.

The only moderate on that list is Regina.

It's not a complete list.

martin14 martin14:

$1:

We all knew this would happen when Streaker, Lilly and that crowd got banned just for existing;

No, they were groupbanned for being members of the supersecret Facebook Group.
Nothing more, but more than existing. How easy the 'misinterpretations' flow.

Interesting recollection, given that it's wrong. I was a member of that group, and I'm still here. And why would any place ban people for using another social media site? Hmmmm? Are all the Twitter users next?

martin14 martin14:

$1:

A pointless effort, in my eyes.

I really should comment on this, but I won't.

You are large percentage of the reason for it. You troll just as hard as anyone else! You, Brah, Newz. . . - we don't even pay attention to their posts anymore because that's what people expect of them now.

It's rather sad too, because I used to enjoy your contributions to the site. Bike trips through Europe, tours of War Cemeteries. Sad, but good for perspective on things. Now you just spend your time trying to get a rise out of Beaver. But I'm hopeful that its just a phase, and the old Martin will return one day.

[DrCaleb]

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

bootlegga bootlegga:

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

Just wondering where the outrage from the people who had complete melt downs when Harper pushed his ominbus bills through is?

It was wrong for any party to use, no matter who their leader is.

But it's always interesting when opposition parties find omnibus bills an attack on democracy, but once they get into office, they use them too. I've little doubt that if Scheer wins in October, his party will use them just like his predecessors have.

Exactly. The more they change the more they stay the same and that's what scares me about this attempt to subvert the rights of succeeding gov'ts. If Trudeau get's away with it, how long will it take till the Conservatives do the exact same thing only it won't be one bill it'll be two or three and so on and so forth till we have no need of politicians anymore since every facet of gov't will be written in unchangeable bills.

The Omnibus bill was weaponized by Harper. Trudeau sees that, and will use it to his advantage. It can't be put back into Pandora's box, and there is nothing the average voter can do about it. It's also not important enough to the average voter to bother.

[martin14]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

You are large percentage of the reason for it.

Are you trying to insinuate people left CKA because of my posts ?

Oh, I would love to see some proof of that.

$1:

It's rather sad too, because I used to enjoy your contributions to the site. Bike trips through Europe, tours of War Cemeteries.

Right, so as long as I am spending my money and posting pretty pictures,
everything is fine, but the second I have a political opinion, now I am
not a nice guy anymore.

FTR, I have been reconstructing a house we bought a few months ago;
there are pics and video of that as well, been a fun project,
but.... No. This place has changed, a lot, and not for the better.
]