[andyt]

I believe they will. Banks won't allow you to enter with face covered. I've heard no human rights cases where somebody challenged that.

As for sharia courts, I said my position clearly. No religious judicial or quasi judicial bodies of any kind.

[ccga3359]

andyt andyt:

As for sharia courts, I said my position clearly. No religious judicial or quasi judicial bodies of any kind.

[BartSimpson]

Remind me again why I'm a racist for not wanting this sharia bullshit in the USA?

[Lemmy]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Remind me again why I'm a racist for not wanting this sharia bullshit in the USA?

You already have it. It's called beit din and it's been going on in the USA since forever.

[andyt]

But the Jews are the good guys. It's OK for them to have these courts. Maybe that's why he's being called a racist, because he only objects when Muslims do it.

[BartSimpson]

Lemmy Lemmy:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Remind me again why I'm a racist for not wanting this sharia bullshit in the USA?

You already have it. It's called beit din and it's been going on in the USA since forever.

I don't see civil courts upholding Jewish decisions like the article says is happening in the United Kaliphate.

[andyt]

Well, good then. I mean any religion can set up their own courts for members who agree to participate, but the state, as you say, should not enforce them.

[Lemmy]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

I don't see civil courts upholding Jewish decisions like the article says is happening in the United Kaliphate.

You don't add strength to your position when you litter it with hyperbole. But wouldn't the logical thing to be to let people resolve their disputes as they see fit and, in cases where those mechanisms result in a decision that doesn't conform to our laws or our constitution, over rule them?

This whole anti-Sharia thing is really much ado about nothing. Why is it any of anyone else's business how private matters are resolved? Should Catholics, for example, not be allowed to go to their priest for help in resolving a conflict? If people are able to solve their grievances without taking it to court isn't that a good thing?

So what exactly is your beef? Is it that you don't think people should be able to solve disputes in any way other than in a courtroom? Is it that you're okay with some forms of extrajudicial resolution and not others? Or is it just more "Islam = evil" nonsense? I guess I just can't understand why you care how others resolve their disputes.

[Thanos]

Lemmy Lemmy:

This whole anti-Sharia thing is really much ado about nothing. Why is it any of anyone else's business how private matters are resolved? If people are able to solve their grievances without taking it to court isn't that a good thing?

Because things like this are usually accompanied by massive amounts of wife beating, marital rape, threats to leave them in poverty or to even have them killed, and to have them permanently shunned by the entire community which would sever all their ties to family and friends. The women and girls (because an appallingly large number of them are underage) are intimidated into compliance from the beginning and remain terrified enough that they're paralyzed into inaction. This is no different than what a bastard like Warren Jeffs tried to pull off with his polygamous Mormon cult in the US. These Muslim males engaging in this same crap deserve to go to prison for it as much as Jeffs did.

[andyt]

The decisions of these courts should not be legally binding. Have them all you want, and if both parties agree, they can abide by the decision. But if one party doesn't, the state should not enforce the decision. We know how women are abused in both the fundamentalist Muslim and Jewish communities. These are the people having these courts in the first place. As indicated by the OP. We don't want the state involved in that.

[martin14]

Lemmy Lemmy:

This whole anti-Sharia thing is really much ado about nothing. Why is it any of anyone else's business how private matters are resolved? Should Catholics, for example, not be allowed to go to their priest for help in resolving a conflict? If people are able to solve their grievances without taking it to court isn't that a good thing?
.

Apples and oranges. The sharia courts do make a legal decision, obviously the
Catholic priest does not.

Straws, grasping.

[Lemmy]

Thanos Thanos:

Because things like this are usually accompanied by massive amounts of wife beating, marital rape, threats to leave them in poverty or to even have them killed, and to have them permanently shunned by the entire community which would sever all their ties to family and friends. The women and girls (because an appallingly large number of them are underage) are intimidated into compliance from the beginning and remain terrified enough that they're paralyzed into inaction. This is no different than what a bastard like Warren Jeffs tried to pull off with his polygamous Mormon cult in the US. These Muslim males engaging in this same crap deserve to go to prison for it as much as Jeffs did.

That's absolutely a concern, which is, again, why we should over-rule any extra-judicial outcome that has in it a violation of our laws. But you don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. Your use of "usually" is untrue. Usually these cases involve simple, private disputes that are resolved in manners perfectly consistent with our laws. Your opening statement, were it truthful, would go like "Because these things are rarely accompanied by..." we need to set some rules. A lot of the problems you identify, rightly, come from the fact that these hearings are done under cover of dark. But if we allowed them, and made their decisions subject to judicial review, those problems could be identified and combated. As it is, Sharia happens. Its users just don't broadcast it too much. Get the whole thing out into the light and then maybe things will be better for Muslim (and Jewish and Catholic) women.

[Jin-Gitaxias]

Pat Condell and Phil "Thunderf00t" Mason have been talking about this for quite some time now ... but they're both "Islamophobic" so nobody pays any attention to them.