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andyt
CKA Uber
Posts: 33492
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:27 am
Yep, just mix with diesel and it can hurt you plenty.
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andyt
CKA Uber
Posts: 33492
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:28 am
Yep, just mix with diesel and it can hurt you plenty. We used to use it in road building.
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Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:36 am
DrCaleb DrCaleb: Delwin Delwin: The Oklahoma City Bomb used 2.3 Tonnes. No, they used ANFO. You change the nature of a chemical by adding two together. Ammonium Nitrate is harmless, unless you eat it. OK, it was actually ANNM. Ammonium Nitrate and Nitro methane, but I guess I'm missing the point. Kind of like, they use chicken in their soup...no they use CHICKEN AND PEAS !
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andyt
CKA Uber
Posts: 33492
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:38 am
They were just going to fertilize the parliament lawn.
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Posts: 4235
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:54 am
andyt andyt: They were just going to fertilize the parliament lawn. 
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Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:55 am
3.Capable of detonation or explosive decomposition but requires a strong initiating source, must be heated under confinement before initiation, reacts explosively with water, or will detonate if severely shocked (e.g. ammonium nitrate, chlorine trifluoride)
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Ammonium Nitrate.jpg [ 9.5 KiB | Viewed 124 times ]
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Posts: 53399
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 8:01 am
Delwin Delwin: DrCaleb DrCaleb: Delwin Delwin: The Oklahoma City Bomb used 2.3 Tonnes. No, they used ANFO. You change the nature of a chemical by adding two together. Ammonium Nitrate is harmless, unless you eat it. OK, it was actually ANNM. Ammonium Nitrate and Nitro methane, but I guess I'm missing the point. Kind of like, they use chicken in their soup...no they use CHICKEN AND PEAS ! That's the difference. Possession of fertilizer is not illegal, yet you want to jail them for life for what thousands of farmers do every day. Mixing an oxidizer and accelerant - that's the bad part. They are in jail for intending to do harm, not for actually doing any. And, you probably don't want to give me a Chemistry lesson. 
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Posts: 7835
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 8:05 am
Don't you require a permit to purchase such large amounts of fertilizer? I'm pretty sure in the US you need to, but I'm not sure if it's the same here in Canada.
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Posts: 53399
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 8:08 am
commanderkai commanderkai: Don't you require a permit to purchase such large amounts of fertilizer? I'm pretty sure in the US you need to, but I'm not sure if it's the same here in Canada. Yes, anything with a high Nitrate value is monitored, even in small amounts. But I can still go to the greenhouse and buy 50kg of fertilizer and no one questions me.
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andyt
CKA Uber
Posts: 33492
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 8:11 am
Not sure what your point is, Caleb. If they had a large number of semiautomatic weapons, that's not inherently illegal either. Conspiracy to commit a serious crime is a serious offense all on it's own. They wouldn't have had to possess an ounce of fertilizer to be convicted of that. The fertilizer is just further proof of their intentions to do serious harm
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Posts: 7835
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 8:20 am
DrCaleb DrCaleb: commanderkai commanderkai: Don't you require a permit to purchase such large amounts of fertilizer? I'm pretty sure in the US you need to, but I'm not sure if it's the same here in Canada. Yes, anything with a high Nitrate value is monitored, even in small amounts. But I can still go to the greenhouse and buy 50kg of fertilizer and no one questions me. That's great, except he was arrested while he was unloading 2 tons, or 2000 kilograms of what he believed was fertilizer. Now, with a quick glance, I see ammonium nitrate as having a use in fertilizer, making instant cold packs, and bomb making. Is there a legitimate reason that Saad Khalid would have to be caught unloading 2000kg of ammonium nitrate? Does he have a garden the size of downtown Toronto?
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Posts: 53399
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:05 am
andyt andyt: Not sure what your point is, Caleb. If they had a large number of semiautomatic weapons, that's not inherently illegal either. Conspiracy to commit a serious crime is a serious offense all on it's own. They wouldn't have had to possess an ounce of fertilizer to be convicted of that. The fertilizer is just further proof of their intentions to do serious harm commanderkai commanderkai: That's great, except he was arrested while he was unloading 2 tons, or 2000 kilograms of what he believed was fertilizer. Now, with a quick glance, I see ammonium nitrate as having a use in fertilizer, making instant cold packs, and bomb making. Is there a legitimate reason that Saad Khalid would have to be caught unloading 2000kg of ammonium nitrate?
Does he have a garden the size of downtown Toronto? I think you both missed my point. Jonny_C Jonny_C: Two tonnes of ammonium nitrate.
You realize how many people that could have killed?
And he gets parole when? Probably 10 years or less. -->>He should be in prison for life.<<<--- Prison for life is not a reasonable sentence for an intent to do harm. Possession of a legal substance, legitimate or not, is also not a reason to jail someone for life. He intended to use fertilizer in a bomb. That's why this guy is doing 10 years. Should I bold that, so everyone reads it?
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andyt
CKA Uber
Posts: 33492
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:09 am
He's doing 20 after the crown appealed his sentence. AFAIK, conspiring to commit a crime can carry the same sentence as actually carrying out the crime.
As I said, I have no problem with him getting 20 years, out possibly in 6 2/3, (I believe he's already done 7 with time served) as long as the parole board keeps a close eye on him when he's out. That's where the system will fail.
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Posts: 33691
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:13 am
DrCaleb DrCaleb: Prison for life is not a reasonable sentence for an intent to do harm. Possession of a legal substance, legitimate or not, is also not a reason to jail someone for life.
Should I bold that, so everyone reads it? So, because I catch you with your hand inside the cookie jar, but you fail to get the cookie, you should get a walk ? The crime is in the intent and planning, not just the execution of it. By that rationale, the cops should have let the boys finish and detonate the bomb, so to secure a better prison sentence. 
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Posts: 53399
Posted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:17 am
andyt andyt: He's doing 20 after the crown appealed his sentence. AFAIK, conspiring to commit a crime can carry the same sentence as actually carrying out the crime.
As I said, I have no problem with him getting 20 years, out possibly in 6 2/3, (I believe he's already done 7 with time served) as long as the parole board keeps a close eye on him when he's out. That's where the system will fail. Yup, conspiracy is basically the same as doing it. I don't disagree with the sentence either. I just get tired of people who think justice and retribution are the same thing.
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