[dino_bobba_renno]

DerbyX DerbyX:

dino_bobba_renno dino_bobba_renno:

DerbyX DerbyX:

Except you are both wrong and both ignoring Harpers doing the same thing.

EI premiums are tax deductible. In other words everybody who pays EI can reduce the amount of federal tax they owe by that amount.

So what does that have to do with anything? I give the government a dollar and they give me a tax credit worth between 20 and 30 cents. That still leaves me out out of pocket for 70 cents which will go into a employment insurance slush fund from which I will never be entitled to collect a dime from.

What it means is that because its tax deductible it comes off any income tax owed.

Lets say you owe X dollars in tax but deduct 700 from it for EI contributions. Another person owes the same amount but doesn't pay into the EI fund doesn't get that deduction.

You and he both owe the same amount in tax yet you pay 700 dollars less and you get access to Employment Insurance.

Why should you owe less tax because you pay EI. Paying EI doesn't mean you get less services from the govt so why should you pay less? My uncle has been a "piece-work" drywaller his entire life. He never paid EI and was never eligible to collect it either. Why should he have to pay more tax then a drywaller making the same amount but working for a company proper and paying EI?

Thats like being allowed to deduct auto insurance premiums. People with cars pay less income tax then people who don't own one?

In addition, why is it that when the EI fund was underfunded did the govt have to make up the shortfall?

The entire amound paid into the EI fund is tax deductible both for employees and employers, who BTW paid far more into it so the actual amount used that constitued "employee" contributions is significantly less then the 54 billion claimed by labour unions. The govt is forever giving tax breaks to employers, bailing them out like the auto industry or simply allowing them to defer taxes owed until the next millenium so I have little sympathy with unions crying foul over the EI fund while they scream at the govt for billions to bail them out.

So because EI contributions come directly out of the taxes owed that go into general revenue they decrease the amount of money the govt has, money that has already been spent on healthcare, education, infrastructure, etc.

The only thing about this I don't like is that the Libs changed the rules making it harder for people who had been paying into EI to collect it when needed. However like everything in life there are multiple sides. Prior to that change Canada was being called a welfare state and people were abusing EI. They'd work the minimum hours to qualify then quit their job and go back on unemployment. I recall one summer by buddy and I were applying for a packing job, the same job his mother and her friend were applying for. They were discussing the job one day and the friend was commenting on how her EI was up and she needed to be employed for whatever days/hours to qualify again.

Of course back then we were teens and I didn't know jack about any of that stuff.

I just spent about 5 minutes typing up a responce to this and I hit wrong damn button and it's gone. *shakes his head* Don't you hate when that happens

[DerbyX]

dino_bobba_renno dino_bobba_renno:

I just spent about 5 minutes typing up a responce to this and I hit wrong damn button and it's gone. *shakes his head* Don't you hate when that happens

Yes. I once spent over an hour crafting a response and lost it at the mercy of an errant keystroke.

The next day I purchased a replacement keyboard.

[ziggy]

herbie herbie:

$1:

Can you collect if you get fired?

Yes, but there's a longer waiting period.
You guys don't know the ropes! Most of this surplus was built with a few simple steps.
First, all they do is hassle a large block of applicants. You were fired. Sorry.
More than half the people stop there. They don't appeal, they don't call, write or go into the EI office, they just whine to their friends. HUGE savings.
Apply for retraining: you automatically miss the first cheque because you're disqualified 'as you're not available for work' even though the shitheads set you up. ANOTHER big percentage just gives up.
Most of the applicants don't want to make the slightest effort. I know several so fucking lazy they didn't even apply because the 'forms were too hard'. These people disqualify themselves, don't deserve EI.
This has filtered down to every agency, or at least it has here in BC. I know a guy with this weird disease eating away his tendons. They moved the Welfare office to another town, and schedule him an appointment at 9:30 a.m. It's a small town area, everyone knows the bus doesn't leave until 9:15 and doesn't get there until 9:55. So when the guy shows up they rail at him that he doesn't even have the ambition 'to show up for his appointment on time and tell him to come back next month.
Next month he shows up and they take his bus receipts and refund him $2.75 each way, knowing full well he paid $20 each way as there's only Greyhound service.
Then the guy has the gall to ask if they'd supply fenders for his electric wheelchair (they cost $200) because he gets soaked and covered with mud. They tell a guy with no leg function and only 1 working arm to 'bring a change of clothes in a plastic bag and change when you get there'....
Of course they LOSE every appeal. But well over half of claimants won't even make an appeal!

Well my buddy from Cape Breton would have to do up a timeline for the last month and contacted everyone he worked with and then probably fly out to BC for hearings,I tried to help him as much as possible as I'm closer to the people who fucked him and the others around but it would have cost thousands of dollars and major time for him to win an appeal.This wasnt possible as the people he worked with were now scattered all over Canada so one guys word on the phone literally fucked about a dozen people from their EI.

[uwish]

DerbyX DerbyX:

PluggyRug PluggyRug:

Except that that the taxpayers were unknowingly paying down the debt and the Libs took credit.

No. The taxpayers expected it. Thats why the Libs were elected. To clean the grit dirt away.

The taxpayers were on the hock for 550 billion in debt before Chretien took office.

550 billion in debt, 30 billion in deficit and all the con hacks can reference is not buying the helos for 10 billion.

Any other party would have bankrupted Canada.

well, then the way I see it. The coalition and Canadians should expect the Harper government to move forward with their plans. It isn't hidden.

and the contract for those helos was never 10 billion, don't invent numbers, and your right the deficit was high. But don't let history blind you, in the past 100 years of Canadian Government 75 of them have been Liberal. So who truly is to blame for that 550 billion in debt?????

[RUEZ]

herbie herbie:

$1:

Can you collect if you get fired?

Yes, but there's a longer waiting period.

Actually it's not that cut and dried. If you get fired or if you quit, you have to fill out forms and convince an EI counsellor that you had justification for quitting or your firing was unjustified. You are not guaranteed EI if you are fired.

[Brenda]

RUEZ RUEZ:

herbie herbie:

$1:

Can you collect if you get fired?

Yes, but there's a longer waiting period.

Actually it's not that cut and dried. If you get fired or if you quit, you have to fill out forms and convince an EI counsellor that you had justification for quitting or your firing was unjustified. You are not guaranteed EI if you are fired.

Which is reasonable. Why would you be able to collect EI when you stole from your boss and got your ass fired ovet that?

[RUEZ]

Interesting, I just found this on the EI website:

$1:

What is the EI premium rate and how does it affect me?

As of January 1st, 2008 you must pay EI premiums on all your earnings up to the annual maximum salary of $41,100. The EI premium rate is set to $1.73 for every $100 of salary until $41,100 has been reached. The maximum contribution amount will be $711.03.

As for Quebec residents, the EI premium rate is set to $1.39 for every $100 of salary until $41,100 has been reached. The maximum contribution amount will be $571.29 for these individuals.

To know more about EI premiums for 2008… Government of Canada Site

To know more about EI premiums for 2007… Government of Canada Site

There is no age limit for deducting EI premiums. In fact, if you are working in insurable employment, your employer deducts from you salary the applicable EI premiums, whatever your age. To know more on payroll deductions... Government of Canada Site

I hope this means that Quebec residents get less EI. Otherwise this stinks.

[bootlegga]

ziggy ziggy:

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

herbie herbie:

Well there's one sure way to get your money back.
Go up to your boss Monday and let him know what an ignorant prick he is. You'll start getting it all back quickly.
Or just wait a few months the way things are going..... and you'll get it back with a shorter waiting period!

Can you collect if you get fired?

The only experience I have with EI is when my wife took maternity leave. She got EI and mat pay from the division. $ 800(EI) one week and then $ 900(Mat pay) the next.

No you cant collect unless your laid off,and in the case with all the easterners I worked with on the first job up north all it took was a phone call from a prick of a supervisor saying he fired them and they were all turned down.

BS, sure you can.

You can even get it if you quit. The 'rules' might say those who get fired and quit aren't allowed, but all you have to do is file an appeal and most of the time, it's gets accepted. The trick is to go to your doctor and get him convinced you're sick/sore back/whatever. We've had six people fired/quit from the office I work in the past 16 months and they ALL got to collect EI. One girl walked out on the first day back from her 2 week vacation and claimed she was stressed out...she's collecting EI right now.

The 'rules' only stop honest people (and maybe serial EI abusers) from getting it.

[uwish]

well, that may be the case but to me, that is another one of those situations where the government is hoping you don't appeal.

To me that is BS. They shouldn't have a system where you are rejected almost by default for quitting or being fired and then have to go threw the appeals process.

And that law parades around the masses like gospel. Many people I talk to say you simply do not qualify when you quit or get fired. Plus, when you read the 'law' that states you may not qualify for benefits if you leave, likely throw in the towel.

Granted, I don't want people collecting it for being fired with just cause. But I don't think it is as straight forward as you claim. Never been on UI myself so I have no first hand knowledge however.

[bootlegga]

My knowledge comes from conversations with people in our HR department. They are always pissed when they are informed that someone who quit for no reason gets EI.

I have to agree. A friend I used to know had a brother who was a serial abuser of EI. He would get a job, circle the 20th week on his calendar and then quit the second he qualified for EI. Talk about lazy...the only good thing that came out of that was when he applied to be a surgeon at a hospital (he's an uneducuated burnout) in town. He knew he wouldn't get the job, but had to apply to satisfy EI and they instead offered him a janitorial job, which because of EI, he was forced to take.

[ziggy]

With my buddy Frank and the other bunch of guys they were told by EI that they could be charged with fraud for saying they were laid off which was also on the ROE the company sent them.The ROE the company sent EI said dismissal was the reason.

So all these guys that flew back to their homes all over the country are now told by EI to get ahold of everyone they worked with the last 6 months and to do up a timeline of everything they did the 2 weeks prior to getting "laid off" which is near impossible when the guys are scattered all over Canada.

The only way this Supervisor could get more of his family and friends on site was to get rid of the guys that had worked for them for the last few years to make room for mom,bro's sisters,girlfriends,etc.

Then when these peeps were back home thousands of miles away he really didnt care what happened to them.

My only advice was to go see a labour lawyer and do an unfair dismissal case because you cant be fired without just cause,or go open a file up with the human right's commision.Then maybe EI will take you seriously.

I felt really bad about this as frank and the others were all the hardest working toughest bunch of guys I have had the pleasure of living in camp with,I requested a few just to stay over xmas with me last year because I knew they could cut the mustard and do anything that needed to be done to survive in an exploration camp.
When he went back to Cape Breton he had enough coin to move back into the family homestead and start a small bussiness,he planned on useing EI to take the edges off his start up costs.So because of one asshole supervisor's word on the phone a half dozen guys like Frank are now back east with no stamps.

So it's abused by more then just the workers by the look's of it.
Frank's name prolly pops up a red flag on the EI computers now and will for a long time.

[uwish]

yeah it's a slippery slope I think.