[romanP]

Brenda Brenda:

romanP romanP:

Aurora_Janus Aurora_Janus:

romanP romanP:

We create things from our dreams all the time.

Right. But that's not believing something into existence. That's making something happen.

Alexander Graham Bell didn't believe the phone into happening, he picked up a screwdriver.

That is my point exactly. Magic is the end result of karma, if we define karma as the action required for cause and effect, and magic as the realisation of our dreams. How else do you explain how an idea from your head turned into something you can touch?

Ehmmm, work?

Work is action is karma.

Some definitions of "realisation" include "making real or giving the appearance of reality" or "something that is made real or concrete."

[Brenda]

romanP romanP:

Brenda Brenda:

romanP romanP:

Aurora_Janus Aurora_Janus:

romanP romanP:

We create things from our dreams all the time.

Right. But that's not believing something into existence. That's making something happen.

Alexander Graham Bell didn't believe the phone into happening, he picked up a screwdriver.

That is my point exactly. Magic is the end result of karma, if we define karma as the action required for cause and effect, and magic as the realisation of our dreams. How else do you explain how an idea from your head turned into something you can touch?

Ehmmm, work?

Work is action is karma.

Disagree.

In your words karma is the same as work. That makes karma nothing more than another word for work. And the end result of work magic. There is nothing magical about clean dishes in my cupboards, or a broken car fixed, or an invoice typed.

[Brenda]

romanP romanP:

Brenda Brenda:

romanP romanP:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Blue_Nose Blue_Nose:

You can make something up and believe it, but that doesn't make it exist outside your head.

To believe in something, and not to live it, is dishonest.

If you live as you believe then you can make it so.

I think you're confusing belief with ideation, or dreaming. Holding onto certitude that anything is true won't make it so. Having an idea and thinking about how to make it real, and putting those thoughts into action (this is karma) will eventually make the dream real (this is magic).

Working hard to make your dreams come true, and actually do that is magic?

That is just hard work for a cause, nothing magical about it...

I think it's pretty magical. Things like lightbulbs and computers wouldn't exist if humans hadn't thought of them and then built them.

Of course they wouldn't. But to put a label "magical" on it, is kinda "zweefteverig" (sorry, it's dutch, I have no idea how to translate that well ), misty maybe, witchcrafty, treehuggerish, vague...

You make it sound like every idea anyone ever has, and creates it into something touchable, is magical. That makes me magical for coming up with this answer

[romanP]

Brenda Brenda:

romanP romanP:

Brenda Brenda:

romanP romanP:

Aurora_Janus Aurora_Janus:

romanP romanP:

We create things from our dreams all the time.

Right. But that's not believing something into existence. That's making something happen.

Alexander Graham Bell didn't believe the phone into happening, he picked up a screwdriver.

That is my point exactly. Magic is the end result of karma, if we define karma as the action required for cause and effect, and magic as the realisation of our dreams. How else do you explain how an idea from your head turned into something you can touch?

Ehmmm, work?

Work is action is karma.

Disagree.

In your words karma is the same as work. That makes karma nothing more than another word for work. And the end result of work magic. There is nothing magical about clean dishes in my cupboards, or a broken car fixed, or an invoice typed.

Those things would never be done if no action was taken to make them complete.
Karma is the sanskrit word for "act, action, or performance."

[Brenda]

$1:

Some definitions of "realisation" include "making real or giving the appearance of reality" or "something that is made real or concrete."

so realisation = magic?

[Brenda]

romanP romanP:

Those things would never be done if no action was taken to make them complete.
Karma is the sanskrit word for "act, action, or performance."

ok, I'll buy that (I can't write or read Sanskrit, so I'll take your word for it), but what does magic have to do with work? Another Sanskrit translation?

[romanP]

Brenda Brenda:

romanP romanP:

Brenda Brenda:

romanP romanP:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Blue_Nose Blue_Nose:

You can make something up and believe it, but that doesn't make it exist outside your head.

To believe in something, and not to live it, is dishonest.

If you live as you believe then you can make it so.

I think you're confusing belief with ideation, or dreaming. Holding onto certitude that anything is true won't make it so. Having an idea and thinking about how to make it real, and putting those thoughts into action (this is karma) will eventually make the dream real (this is magic).

Working hard to make your dreams come true, and actually do that is magic?

That is just hard work for a cause, nothing magical about it...

I think it's pretty magical. Things like lightbulbs and computers wouldn't exist if humans hadn't thought of them and then built them.

Of course they wouldn't. But to put a label "magical" on it, is kinda "zweefteverig" (sorry, it's dutch, I have no idea how to translate that well ), misty maybe, witchcrafty, treehuggerish, vague...

Why shouldn't it be vague? It's in the future, and the future is not certain. Your actions may be unsuccessful in completing what you set out to do!

$1:

You make it sound like every idea anyone ever has, and creates it into something touchable, is magical. That makes me magical for coming up with this answer

Sure, why not? Did you intend to do something different?

[romanP]

Brenda Brenda:

$1:

Some definitions of "realisation" include "making real or giving the appearance of reality" or "something that is made real or concrete."

so realisation = magic?

I think so. How is it much different from the idea of witches and warlocks conjuring up certain events? Either way, something had to be imagined and then made real.

[romanP]

Brenda Brenda:

romanP romanP:

Those things would never be done if no action was taken to make them complete.
Karma is the sanskrit word for "act, action, or performance."

ok, I'll buy that (I can't write or read Sanskrit, so I'll take your word for it), but what does magic have to do with work? Another Sanskrit translation?

Things don't happen as a result of no action. Without action, nothing can become real.

[Brenda]

romanP romanP:

Brenda Brenda:

romanP romanP:

Brenda Brenda:

romanP romanP:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Blue_Nose Blue_Nose:

You can make something up and believe it, but that doesn't make it exist outside your head.

To believe in something, and not to live it, is dishonest.

If you live as you believe then you can make it so.

I think you're confusing belief with ideation, or dreaming. Holding onto certitude that anything is true won't make it so. Having an idea and thinking about how to make it real, and putting those thoughts into action (this is karma) will eventually make the dream real (this is magic).

Working hard to make your dreams come true, and actually do that is magic?

That is just hard work for a cause, nothing magical about it...

I think it's pretty magical. Things like lightbulbs and computers wouldn't exist if humans hadn't thought of them and then built them.

Of course they wouldn't. But to put a label "magical" on it, is kinda "zweefteverig" (sorry, it's dutch, I have no idea how to translate that well ), misty maybe, witchcrafty, treehuggerish, vague...

Why shouldn't it be vague? It's in the future, and the future is not certain. Your actions may be unsuccessful in completing what you set out to do!

$1:

You make it sound like every idea anyone ever has, and creates it into something touchable, is magical. That makes me magical for coming up with this answer

Sure, why not? Did you intend to do something different?

Well, magical imho, is something you have no hand in, that is beyond you. My answers are mine, have my signature on them. So that can not be magical, if you have the logic I have. But if the definition of magic is the result of a job done, then you are right. So I guess it all depends on your definition of magic.

ANd mine obviously differs from yours

[Brenda]

romanP romanP:

Brenda Brenda:

$1:

Some definitions of "realisation" include "making real or giving the appearance of reality" or "something that is made real or concrete."

so realisation = magic?

I think so. How is it much different from the idea of witches and warlocks conjuring up certain events? Either way, something had to be imagined and then made real.

That makes idea + action = job done. But that doesn't mean that job done = magic

[romanP]

Brenda Brenda:

$1:

$1:

$1:

You make it sound like every idea anyone ever has, and creates it into something touchable, is magical. That makes me magical for coming up with this answer

Sure, why not? Did you intend to do something different?

Well, magical imho, is something you have no hand in, that is beyond you.

My answers are mine, have my signature on them. So that can not be magical, if you have the logic I have. But if the definition of magic is the result of a job done, then you are right. So I guess it all depends on your definition of magic.

ANd mine obviously differs from yours

Not so much. If someone else does something for you, that is also magic, as it is the end result of someone else's actions.

There are no supernatural miracles, or events that happen in a vacuum, or things that happen which defy physics. Everything happens because of something else happening. Everything, in happening, causes something else to happen. That is reason, and nothing exists without it.

[romanP]

Brenda Brenda:

romanP romanP:

Brenda Brenda:

$1:

Some definitions of "realisation" include "making real or giving the appearance of reality" or "something that is made real or concrete."

so realisation = magic?

I think so. How is it much different from the idea of witches and warlocks conjuring up certain events? Either way, something had to be imagined and then made real.

That makes idea + action = job done. But that doesn't mean that job done = magic

Why not? You have yet to explain this position, only to state it over and over.

[Brenda]

$1:

There are no supernatural miracles, events that happen in a vacuum, or things that happen which defy physics. Everything happens because of something else happening. Everything, in happening, causes something else to happen. That is reason, and nothing exists without it.

I fully agree with you on this.

$1:

Not so much. If someone else does something for you, that is also magic, as it is also the end result of someone else's actions.

But not on this. Magic is not the same as the result of action. Magic imo is supernatural, a miracle, which doesn't exist, which makes magic non-existable.

[Brenda]

romanP romanP:

Brenda Brenda:

That makes idea + action = job done. But that doesn't mean that job done = magic

Why not? You have yet to explain this position, only to state it over and over.

Didn't I mention before that magic is nothing man can do? Magic is something that happens without anybody knowing how, or who. Miracles, things disappearing. Things existing out of the bleu... Which all can be explained, therefore magic doesn't exist.