[H2Obuffalo]

WDHIII WDHIII:

the thing that REALLY bothers me about the universe is that "space" is definded by its borders...... without those how can it exist at all?

the borders of the universedo exist, they just are not a constant location, so they not only define "space", but through their expansion, define time as well...

[Constantinople]

I remember reading in a Discover magazine that some scientists are starting to find that maybe the speed of light isn't a constant after all.

[rockymountainrider]

Constantinople Constantinople:

I remember reading in a Discover magazine that some scientists are starting to find that maybe the speed of light isn't a constant after all.

So light could be like an average driver on the 400 series highways that accelerates and brakes for seemingly no reason and is incapable of maintaining a steady rate of speed regardless of paying for cuise control for their SUV?

[H2Obuffalo]

that is true, they now beleive that like other aves, the speed varries with the medium, though it is so slight, and at such high speeds, that it is extremely dificult to detect any variance.

as for the cruise control, i think it is just that most SUV seem to have one big flaw - faulty drivers who feel over secure and forget that there might be other vehicles out there. lol (no offence to any SUV drivers of course, just my personal experience)

[H2Obuffalo]

there is no actual defined boarders, but they are implied, as it makes it easier to comprehend the ever expanding part of things, you cannot actually physically go to "the boarders of space", they do not physically exist, hence the theory that if you mange to escape the bounds of the universe, it would be impossible to return, as you would not be able to find it again....

[H2Obuffalo]

"the borders of the universe do exist, in a sense, they do not physically exist, they are only refered to as an implication, they are not a constant location, and they cannot actually be seen or reached, but they not only define "space", but through their expansion, define time as well, which is how we actually know that the universise is changing in size ie: expanding..."

better?

[rockymountainrider]

What if the "border" was defined as the furthest reach of light from the big bang? Presumably that should be where "we" collide with whatever was here before? It would meet the criteria for being mobile and unreachable. A front with a couple billion light years of a lead would be very tough to catch I think.

[H2Obuffalo]

before our universe was here, the thing that occupied the "space" was .... our universe. once it reaches the maximum size(critical mass/volume, whatever you want to call it), it will biging to recee and shrik back down to its infantesimal smpec, at which time we will have another "big bang" and restart... that is another reason it is hard to guess what is outside the universe, as we dont know what it keeps expanding into untill it reaches its criticall mass....

[Blue_Nose]

The fact that humans see space as existing is merely a coping mechanism. We call the space between four walls a room, when in fact, it's the walls surrounding the room that exist, not the space itself. The universe is not actually bounded by anything, other than the imaginary limits we've deicided upon.

There are a lot of very abstract theories floating around regarding the properties of the universe. One that I find particularly interesting is the idea that the universe is much like a globe (that is, a two dimensional spherical surface), and our perception of a third dimension is some sort of holographic illusion (it's much more complex than that, but that's the general idea, and I don't really understand it fully, nor would most here).

I think that implies that the 'end' of the universe is actually the same as the beginning, or another universe altogether, so it'd keep repeating if you went in a straight line.

In my experience, these matters are usually better left to those with scientific background and involvement in the topic, and who actually have something to gain from their consideration. Always an interesting discussion though.

[rockymountainrider]

H2Obuffalo H2Obuffalo:

before our universe was here, the thing that occupied the "space" was .... our universe. once it reaches the maximum size(critical mass/volume, whatever you want to call it), it will biging to recee and shrik back down to its infantesimal smpec, at which time we will have another "big bang" and restart... that is another reason it is hard to guess what is outside the universe, as we dont know what it keeps expanding into untill it reaches its criticall mass....

That's assuming a rubber band effect. What about a spark plug? Material is fed in and ignited on a timed basis.

Or someone could have just rebooted the system

[H2Obuffalo]

problem with the spark plug theory is the requirement of outside material, which goes agains "big bang" theory, and newton's law of conservation...

[BartSimpson]

What's beyond the Universe?

Space. More universes. More space. Infinite possibilities.

[rockymountainrider]

H2Obuffalo H2Obuffalo:

problem with the spark plug theory is the requirement of outside material, which goes agains "big bang" theory, and newton's law of conservation...

Wouldn't be the first time...
Too bad I'm not familiar enough with Newton's theory to put forward an ammendment or counter argument...

[SwampoO]

Beyone the Universe?

Starbucks next to a McDonalds and a 7-11

[rockymountainrider]

Douglas Adams' next posthumous book, "The Wal-Mart at the End of the Universe"?