[BartSimpson]

OPP OPP:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

OPP OPP:

I don't care about that. It's how they train that woman. It's discusting. They are hardened to the point that they stop feeling and that's what they want; a killing machine. It's immoral and distasteful.

And necessary.

Without people like that to stand ready to defend your country (Sweden has tough hombres in their military, too) you would be speaking German, Russian, or Norwegian and would not be free to have this little discussion.

I don't believe that for a second. Soldiers that don't feel don't give a shit about human life. I don't want people like that on this earth.

I guess you have never been in uniform, let alone seen action.

I have yet to meet a soldier who doesn't feel something in the course of performing their duties. While they may make insenstive wisecracks to blow off steam, they all feel something and even the toughest of the tough can often be heard screaming in their bunks at night or crying in their beer because being drunk gives them an excuse to let it out.

Even when the situation is clear cut, a lot of guys suffer for years from their actions.

My friend Chris's brother, Wayne, was an MP at Da Nang in Vietnam and he arrived in country just days before the Tet Offensive started.

Here we are forty years later and he'll joke about using the then-new night vision scope to shoot NVA coming through the wire and he'll talk about how he went from the humane headshots to gut-shooting the NVA after thirteen of the sixteen guys in his platoon were killed in their bunks one night by an NVA with a satchel bomb.

In an instant he falls apart when talking about how he shot a child who was running at a column of soldiers. That the child exploded due to the bomb it was carrying and that he saved 20-30 men and that he received a Silver Star for his quick evaluation of the matter doesn't comfort him in the least.

He has spent forty years regretting that action and has lived it over and over.

The thing about military training that you don't understand is that we cannot afford to feel something when our immediate and unthinking action is 100% required to save the lives of our fellow soldiers.

We are trained to do what we are trained to do and when the action is over every last one of us - no matter what side we're on - feels something about it.

All we can do in training is hope that we can be trained to react without thinking so that we do not fail our friends and comrades when the moment comes that lives depend upon us.

No offense intended, but until you've been in the position where lives are depending on your ACTING and not FEELING you have no credibility on this subject.

[novachick]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

OPP OPP:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

OPP OPP:

I don't care about that. It's how they train that woman. It's discusting. They are hardened to the point that they stop feeling and that's what they want; a killing machine. It's immoral and distasteful.

And necessary.

Without people like that to stand ready to defend your country (Sweden has tough hombres in their military, too) you would be speaking German, Russian, or Norwegian and would not be free to have this little discussion.

I don't believe that for a second. Soldiers that don't feel don't give a shit about human life. I don't want people like that on this earth.

I guess you have never been in uniform, let alone seen action.

I have yet to meet a soldier who doesn't feel something in the course of performing their duties. While they may make insenstive wisecracks to blow off steam, they all feel something and even the toughest of the tough can often be heard screaming in their bunks at night or crying in their beer because being drunk gives them an excuse to let it out.

Even when the situation is clear cut, a lot of guys suffer for years from their actions.

My friend Chris's brother, Wayne, was an MP at Da Nang in Vietnam and he arrived in country just days before the Tet Offensive started.

Here we are forty years later and he'll joke about using the then-new night vision scope to shoot NVA coming through the wire and he'll talk about how he went from the humane headshots to gut-shooting the NVA after thirteen of the sixteen guys in his platoon were killed in their bunks one night by an NVA with a satchel bomb.

In an instant he falls apart when talking about how he shot a child who was running at a column of soldiers. That the child exploded due to the bomb it was carrying and that he saved 20-30 men and that he received a Silver Star for his quick evaluation of the matter doesn't comfort him in the least.

He has spent forty years regretting that action and has lived it over and over.

The thing about military training that you don't understand is that we cannot afford to feel something when our immediate and unthinking action is 100% required to save the lives of our fellow soldiers.

We are trained to do what we are trained to do and when the action is over every last one of us - no matter what side we're on - feels something about it.

All we can do in training is hope that we can be trained to react without thinking so that we do not fail our friends and comrades when the moment comes that lives depend upon us.

No offense intended, but until you've been in the position where lives are depending on your ACTING and not FEELING you have no credibility on this subject.

Clap,clap,clap standing ovation here.

[OPP]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

OPP OPP:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

OPP OPP:

I don't care about that. It's how they train that woman. It's discusting. They are hardened to the point that they stop feeling and that's what they want; a killing machine. It's immoral and distasteful.

And necessary.

Without people like that to stand ready to defend your country (Sweden has tough hombres in their military, too) you would be speaking German, Russian, or Norwegian and would not be free to have this little discussion.

I don't believe that for a second. Soldiers that don't feel don't give a shit about human life. I don't want people like that on this earth.

I guess you have never been in uniform, let alone seen action.

I have yet to meet a soldier who doesn't feel something in the course of performing their duties. While they may make insenstive wisecracks to blow off steam, they all feel something and even the toughest of the tough can often be heard screaming in their bunks at night or crying in their beer because being drunk gives them an excuse to let it out.

Even when the situation is clear cut, a lot of guys suffer for years from their actions.

My friend Chris's brother, Wayne, was an MP at Da Nang in Vietnam and he arrived in country just days before the Tet Offensive started.

Here we are forty years later and he'll joke about using the then-new night vision scope to shoot NVA coming through the wire and he'll talk about how he went from the humane headshots to gut-shooting the NVA after thirteen of the sixteen guys in his platoon were killed in their bunks one night by an NVA with a satchel bomb.

In an instant he falls apart when talking about how he shot a child who was running at a column of soldiers. That the child exploded due to the bomb it was carrying and that he saved 20-30 men and that he received a Silver Star for his quick evaluation of the matter doesn't comfort him in the least.

He has spent forty years regretting that action and has lived it over and over.

The thing about military training that you don't understand is that we cannot afford to feel something when our immediate and unthinking action is 100% required to save the lives of our fellow soldiers.

We are trained to do what we are trained to do and when the action is over every last one of us - no matter what side we're on - feels something about it.

All we can do in training is hope that we can be trained to react without thinking so that we do not fail our friends and comrades when the moment comes that lives depend upon us.

No offense intended, but until you've been in the position where lives are depending on your ACTING and not FEELING you have no credibility on this subject.

Sitting crying thirty years later over a beer, as you put it, does not change their actions in the past nor what the army instills into it's soldiers. Of coars they feel. Every one feels something! But war changes everything. You stop being human. You put a lid on your feelings becaus you can't be an effective soldier if you do feel.

Never think that war, no matter how necessary, nor how justified, is not a crime. - Ernest Hemingway

[OPP]

Blue_Nose Blue_Nose:

OPP, explain how training to deal with the physical pain of pepper-spray affects one's personal value for human life.

If you can't see the connection between drills like these and a hardened soul... I don't see how it could be more self evident.

[Blue_Nose]

OPP OPP:

Blue_Nose Blue_Nose:

OPP, explain how training to deal with the physical pain of pepper-spray affects one's personal value for human life.

If you can't see the connection between drills like these and a hardened soal... I don't see how it could be more self evident.

A "hardened soal"? She's merely training to deal with physical pain and partial blindness.

How many times being willingly pepper-sprayed by your peers would it take for your "soal" to be "hardened"? What is this magical relationship between sore eyes and personal appreciation for the lives of others?

[OPP]

novachick novachick:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

OPP OPP:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

OPP OPP:

I don't care about that. It's how they train that woman. It's discusting. They are hardened to the point that they stop feeling and that's what they want; a killing machine. It's immoral and distasteful.

And necessary.

Without people like that to stand ready to defend your country (Sweden has tough hombres in their military, too) you would be speaking German, Russian, or Norwegian and would not be free to have this little discussion.

I don't believe that for a second. Soldiers that don't feel don't give a shit about human life. I don't want people like that on this earth.

I guess you have never been in uniform, let alone seen action.

I have yet to meet a soldier who doesn't feel something in the course of performing their duties. While they may make insenstive wisecracks to blow off steam, they all feel something and even the toughest of the tough can often be heard screaming in their bunks at night or crying in their beer because being drunk gives them an excuse to let it out.

Even when the situation is clear cut, a lot of guys suffer for years from their actions.

My friend Chris's brother, Wayne, was an MP at Da Nang in Vietnam and he arrived in country just days before the Tet Offensive started.

Here we are forty years later and he'll joke about using the then-new night vision scope to shoot NVA coming through the wire and he'll talk about how he went from the humane headshots to gut-shooting the NVA after thirteen of the sixteen guys in his platoon were killed in their bunks one night by an NVA with a satchel bomb.

In an instant he falls apart when talking about how he shot a child who was running at a column of soldiers. That the child exploded due to the bomb it was carrying and that he saved 20-30 men and that he received a Silver Star for his quick evaluation of the matter doesn't comfort him in the least.

He has spent forty years regretting that action and has lived it over and over.

The thing about military training that you don't understand is that we cannot afford to feel something when our immediate and unthinking action is 100% required to save the lives of our fellow soldiers.

We are trained to do what we are trained to do and when the action is over every last one of us - no matter what side we're on - feels something about it.

All we can do in training is hope that we can be trained to react without thinking so that we do not fail our friends and comrades when the moment comes that lives depend upon us.

No offense intended, but until you've been in the position where lives are depending on your ACTING and not FEELING you have no credibility on this subject.

Clap,clap,clap standing ovation here.

Give me a brake "Friends and comrades". Notice how he avoided the words; innocent men women and chilldren?

[OPP]

Blue_Nose Blue_Nose:

OPP OPP:

Blue_Nose Blue_Nose:

OPP, explain how training to deal with the physical pain of pepper-spray affects one's personal value for human life.

If you can't see the connection between drills like these and a hardened soal... I don't see how it could be more self evident.

A "hardened soal"? She's merely training to deal with physical pain and partial blindness.

How many times being willingly pepper-sprayed by your peers would it take for your "soal" to be "hardened"? What is this magical relationship between sore eyes and personal appreciation for the lives of others?

Yes. I noticed my spelling error before you made your post. Again; I don't see how it could be more self evident.

[Wullu]

Brick wall BN.

By OPPs "logic", cops, firefighters, doctors, nurses, paramedics all must have hardened souls since for them to their job at the most stressful times they have to divorce themselves from their feelings to do the job.

An ER doc that is comsumed by the pain of an accident victim cannot do their job. A firefighter cannot let the begging of a home owner to determine their course of action. A cop cannot let the fear of a victim of crime determine where they point an investigation.

That is part and parcel for right here, right fucking now professions like these and the military. OPP will never be able to understand that, and given his loathing of all things American I am willing to bet that if this was a video of Swedish Army training, we never would have heard a peep out of him.

[OPP]

WDHIII WDHIII:

In other words please see the NINE WORDS WOMEN USE thread subsection "If you dont know Im not gonna tell you"

If he believes undergoing training of this kind only affects her endurance for fysical pain, then there is not much I can do or say to change that view. He'll just have to undergo the training for himself.

[novachick]

OPP OPP:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

OPP OPP:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

OPP OPP:

I don't care about that. It's how they train that woman. It's discusting. They are hardened to the point that they stop feeling and that's what they want; a killing machine. It's immoral and distasteful.

And necessary.

Without people like that to stand ready to defend your country (Sweden has tough hombres in their military, too) you would be speaking German, Russian, or Norwegian and would not be free to have this little discussion.

I don't believe that for a second. Soldiers that don't feel don't give a shit about human life. I don't want people like that on this earth.

I guess you have never been in uniform, let alone seen action.

I have yet to meet a soldier who doesn't feel something in the course of performing their duties. While they may make insenstive wisecracks to blow off steam, they all feel something and even the toughest of the tough can often be heard screaming in their bunks at night or crying in their beer because being drunk gives them an excuse to let it out.

Even when the situation is clear cut, a lot of guys suffer for years from their actions.

My friend Chris's brother, Wayne, was an MP at Da Nang in Vietnam and he arrived in country just days before the Tet Offensive started.

Here we are forty years later and he'll joke about using the then-new night vision scope to shoot NVA coming through the wire and he'll talk about how he went from the humane headshots to gut-shooting the NVA after thirteen of the sixteen guys in his platoon were killed in their bunks one night by an NVA with a satchel bomb.

In an instant he falls apart when talking about how he shot a child who was running at a column of soldiers. That the child exploded due to the bomb it was carrying and that he saved 20-30 men and that he received a Silver Star for his quick evaluation of the matter doesn't comfort him in the least.

He has spent forty years regretting that action and has lived it over and over.

The thing about military training that you don't understand is that we cannot afford to feel something when our immediate and unthinking action is 100% required to save the lives of our fellow soldiers.

We are trained to do what we are trained to do and when the action is over every last one of us - no matter what side we're on - feels something about it.

All we can do in training is hope that we can be trained to react without thinking so that we do not fail our friends and comrades when the moment comes that lives depend upon us.

No offense intended, but until you've been in the position where lives are depending on your ACTING and not FEELING you have no credibility on this subject.

Sitting crying thirty years later over a beer, as you put it, does not change their actions in the past nor what the army instills into it's soldiers. Of coars they feel. Every one feels something! But war changes everything. You stop being human. You put a lid on your feelings becaus you can't be an effective soldier if you do feel.

Never think that war, no matter how necessary, nor how justified, is not a crime. - Ernest Hemingway

I'm sorry OPP but I take deep offense to that. Someone very close to my heart had to kill in the line of Duty. He never stopped being human for one second, but as Bart said it's kill or be killed. They are their to do a job, they do IMHO the hardest job known to man. They suffer greatly the after effects of their actions. They see things unimaginable to us in our warm cozy beds. Even our peace keepers not in active combat must do and see things they carry with them for the rest of their lives. They honour us,they honour this country. They train hard because they must to survive. They are fathers, mothers, son's and daughters their hearts are bigger than you and I will ever realize it. They do it so we don't have to.

Take a look at this video ....I Want You To Live- George Canyon

http://www.georgecanyon.com/video.html

[Blue_Nose]

Yes, you know one's argument is based on some sort of thought whatsoever when it's backed up by "If you don't agree there's nothing I can say".

OPP OPP:

If he believes undergoing training of this kind only affects her endurance for fysical pain, then there is not much I can do or say to change that view. He'll just have to undergo the training for himself.

It would also affect her emotional ability to deal with the situation, which, from the stories told on this thread, sounds like half the battle. Putting anyone through training under duress serves to allow that person the ability to handle a rough situation when it arises in a much more controlled manner.

This woman is training to be able to move and defend herself under the effects of blindness and pain - how does that translate to being programmed to mindlessly kill innocent people? If anything, she's more likely to react in a controlled manner, reducing a chance of blindly attacking potentially innocent bystanders.

[OPP]

Wullu Wullu:

Brick wall BN.

By OPPs "logic", cops, firefighters, doctors, nurses, paramedics all must have hardened souls since for them to their job at the most stressful times they have to divorce themselves from their feelings to do the job.

An ER doc that is comsumed by the pain of an accident victim cannot do their job. A firefighter cannot let the begging of a home owner to determine their course of action. A cop cannot let the fear of a victim of crime determine where they point an investigation.

That is part and parcel for right here, right fucking now professions like these and the military. OPP will never be able to understand that, and given his loathing of all things American I am willing to bet that if this was a video of Swedish Army training, we never would have heard a peep out of him.

I saw a documentary about the attacks on russian schools by Chechnian terrorists. The doctor present who had to examine the burnt and dismembered bodies of chilldren said in the interview that his work did not allow him to feel becaus of the emotional distress it would caus and he admitted that the tragic event he witnessed drained him of sympathy, but he does not have a gun in his hand now does he! He is not a trained killer nor is his job to eliminate other human beings

[OPP]

Blue_Nose Blue_Nose:

Yes, you know one's argument is based on some sort of thought whatsoever when it's backed up by "If you don't agree there's nothing I can say".

OPP OPP:

If he believes undergoing training of this kind only affects her endurance for fysical pain, then there is not much I can do or say to change that view. He'll just have to undergo the training for himself.

It would also affect her emotional ability to deal with the situation, which, from the stories told on this thread, sounds like half the battle. Putting anyone through training under duress serves to allow that person the ability to handle a rough situation when it arises in a much more controlled manner.

This woman is training to be able to move and defend herself under the effects of blindness and pain - how does that translate to being programmed to mindlessly kill innocent people? If anything, she's more likely to react in a controlled manner, reducing a chance of blindly attacking potentially innocent bystanders.

Being sprayed with that substance, running around in agony while other soldiers are laughing at you, beating you. Yes, that's all so she can controle a situation when she's in pain.

[stratos]

OPP OPP:

Blue_Nose Blue_Nose:

Yes, you know one's argument is based on some sort of thought whatsoever when it's backed up by "If you don't agree there's nothing I can say".

OPP OPP:

If he believes undergoing training of this kind only affects her endurance for fysical pain, then there is not much I can do or say to change that view. He'll just have to undergo the training for himself.

It would also affect her emotional ability to deal with the situation, which, from the stories told on this thread, sounds like half the battle. Putting anyone through training under duress serves to allow that person the ability to handle a rough situation when it arises in a much more controlled manner.

This woman is training to be able to move and defend herself under the effects of blindness and pain - how does that translate to being programmed to mindlessly kill innocent people? If anything, she's more likely to react in a controlled manner, reducing a chance of blindly attacking potentially innocent bystanders.

Being sprayed with that substance, running around in agony while other soldiers are laughing at you, beating you. Yes, that's all so she can controle a situation when she's in pain.

Actually she does most of the beating. OPP police go threw a very similar training with pepper spray. Its to show you that if you concentrate and ignore the pain you can still function and survive.

[Blue_Nose]

OPP OPP:

Being sprayed with that substance, running around in agony while other soldiers are laughing at you, beating you. Yes, that's all so she can controle a situation when she's in pain.

I'm glad you finally understand.