[andyt]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/health/alcohol-a ... -1.2978302

A

$1:

lcohol-related causes are responsible for seven per cent of all deaths in Canada and substantial disability, according to researchers. The consequences include fractures and other injuries from falls, vehicle collisions and accidents and injuries from violence or alcohol-induced suicides.

Recognizing that 15 per cent to 20 per cent of Canadians do meet the criteria for alcohol disorders, Dr. Anne Moyer of Stony Brook University in New York and Dr. John Finney of the VA Palo Alto Health Care System in Menlo Park, Calif., conducted a review of alcohol misuse. It was published in Monday's issue of the Canadian Medical Association Journal.

[Zipperfish]

Hmmm. The problem I see just from those two paragraphs is that it doesn't match oberserved evidence. There is no doubt that there is a high correlation between crime and alcohol. The problem is that teh violence can be shown to be at least as bad in places/times where alcohol is forbidden. For instance, virtually all types of crime increased during prohibition. Or, as another example, alcohol is forbidden in Afghanistan, yet is quite a brutal culture.

That said, the brief intervention thing is probably a good idea.

People are just going to lie about their alcohol intake though, they way they do about illicit drug use and smoking.

[Thanos]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

People are just going to lie about their alcohol intake though, they way they do about illicit drug use and smoking.

Got that right. If you're gonna do it then go for broke. None of this pussy social drinker tippler bullshit. George Thoroughgood binge pisser or nothing else. Like Johnny The Boy said in Mad Max, "if you're gonna waste The Bronze, ya gotta do it big!".

[OnTheIce]

andy is in full troll-for-attention mode today. Don't feed the troll.

[Zipperfish]

Thanos Thanos:

Got that right. If you're gonna do it then go for broke. None of this pussy social drinker tippler bullshit. George Thoroughgood binge pisser or nothing else. Like Johnny The Boy said in Mad Max, "if you're gonna waste The Bronze, ya gotta do it big!".

Exactly, why are we wasting time with amateurs? I'm a professional drinker.

[Thanos]

Once the house is sold and I'm merrily ensconced in some shithole of a shithead-infested apartment again, I intend to take it up again as my primary Friday night activity, just like in the days when I invented Operation: Piss-Up. With nothing to look forward to ever again and the high point of my life essentially over I probably won't stop again either.

[OnTheIce]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

Thanos Thanos:

Got that right. If you're gonna do it then go for broke. None of this pussy social drinker tippler bullshit. George Thoroughgood binge pisser or nothing else. Like Johnny The Boy said in Mad Max, "if you're gonna waste The Bronze, ya gotta do it big!".

Exactly, why are we wasting time with amateurs? I'm a professional drinker.

[Zipperfish]

Thanos Thanos:

Once the house is sold and I'm merrily ensconced in some shithole of a shithead-infested apartment again, I intend to take it up again as my primary Friday night activity, just like in the days when I invented Operation: Piss-Up. With nothing to look forward to ever again and the high point of my life essentially over I probably won't stop again either.

Well, at least you have a string of misfortunes as an excuse. I have a good, well-paying job, house, loving wife (well, wife anyways) and two wonderful children and I'm still pissing it all away!

[Thanos]

Draw me like one of your French guns, Bart.

[BartSimpson]

Thanos Thanos:

Draw me like one of your French guns, Bart.

But Thanos, I like you too much to portray you as useless.

[Regina]

I'll drink to that!!!

[Xort]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

The problem is that teh violence can be shown to be at least as bad in places/times where alcohol is forbidden. For instance, virtually all types of crime increased during prohibition.

It's not true that with prohibition crime was on the raise. Prior to the start of prohibition crime shot up (1900-1910), but over the duration of prohibition the overall crime rate was steady and continued to be steady. Organized crime became more visible, but not noticeably more violent.

What is true is that the health effects of prohibition were overwhelmingly positive in terms of public health. Alcohol related illnesses generally dropped by 1/2 over the 14 years.

Just because the visible negatives became more visible doesn't mean the overall negatives did. Prohibition was a failure and a success.

However, that's not to say it was right or wrong. Your own political beliefs will tell you that.

For what's it's worth I think that public drunkenness shouldn't be a crime without an aggravating factor. For example noise complaints, property damage, assault/battery or harassment. The chances of a drunk getting by the night without violating any of those conditions is rare, but technically possible.

I think that a public policy shift to limit alcohol use similar to tobacco would be a benefit. No more advertising, large warning labels, no more branded packaging (like Australia for their tobacco).

I don't think it would be accepted, but it's nice to dream.

[Zipperfish]

Xort Xort:

It's not true that with prohibition crime was on the raise. Prior to the start of prohibition crime shot up (1900-1910), but over the duration of prohibition the overall crime rate was steady and continued to be steady. Organized crime became more visible, but not noticeably more violent.

From the wiki entry on prohibition:

$1:

In a study of more than thirty major U.S cities during the Prohibition years of 1920 and 1921, the number of crimes increased by 24 percent. Additionally, theft and burglaries increased by 9 percent, homicides by 12.7 percent, assaults and battery rose by 13 percent, drug addiction by 44.6 percent, and police department costs rose by 11.4 percent. This was largely the result of "black-market violence" and the diversion of law enforcement resources elsewhere. Despite the Prohibition movement's hope that outlawing alcohol would reduce crime, the reality was that the Volstead Act led to higher crime rates than were experienced prior to Prohibition and the establishment of a black market dominated by criminal organizations

There have been several other studies with similar results.

[BartSimpson]

The reason crime spiked during Prohibition was simply because so many Irish were sober for a change.

[Yogi]

Thanos Thanos:

Once the house is sold and I'm merrily ensconced in some shithole of a shithead-infested apartment again, I intend to take it up again as my primary Friday night activity, just like in the days when I invented Operation: Piss-Up. With nothing to look forward to ever again and the high point of my life essentially over I probably won't stop again either.

It's not the hand that life dealt that is wreaking so much havoc on you. Rather, it is how you have chosen to play it out.