[C.M. Burns]

$1:

Russians losing propaganda war

By Paul Reynolds
World affairs correspondent, BBC News

The Bush administration appears to be trying to turn a failed military operation by Georgia into a successful diplomatic operation against Russia.

It is doing so by presenting the Russian actions as aggression and playing down the Georgian attack into South Ossetia on 7 August, which triggered the Russian operation.

Yet the evidence from South Ossetia about that attack indicates that it was extensive and damaging.

Blame game

The BBC's Sarah Rainsford has reported: "Many Ossetians I met both in Tskhinvali and in the main refugee camp in Russia are furious about what has happened to their city.

"They are very clear who they blame: Georgia's President Mikhail Saakashvili, who sent troops to re-take control of this breakaway region."

Human Rights Watch concluded after an on-the-ground inspection: "Witness accounts and the timing of the damage would point to Georgian fire accounting for much of the damage described [in Tskhinvali]."

One problem for the Russians is that they have not yet learned how to play the media game. Their authoritarian government might never do so.

Most of the Western media is based in Georgia. The Russians were slow to give access from their side and this has helped them lose the propaganda war.

Georgia, meanwhile, was comparing this to Prague in 1968 and Budapest in 1956. Even the massacre at Srebrenica was recalled.

Mud sticks

The comparisons did not fit the facts, but some of the mud has stuck and Russia has been on the international defensive.

BBC

[C.M. Burns]

martin14 martin14:

then why are you so happy to defend them ?

In your child-like view of the world there are good guys and bad guys and, of course, you know who the bad guys are, don't? The TV tells you!

Well, you may see what I do as defending the Russians but this again is just the result of your limited intellectual capacity. In reality, what I am doing is providing some facts to counter the propaganda so that the simple among us might realize that the meat puppets on TV aren't always telling the truth!

[martin14]

do they ever tell the truth ?

[EyeBrock]

C.M. Burns C.M. Burns:

tritium tritium:

Russia is getting to be a pain, from invading Georgia to invading Canada's arctic sovereignty.

Invading Canada's arctic sovereignty

Next you're going to tell us that they killed the Easter Bunny!!!

Really, I can't see a good reason why any peace-loving democrat could even support these aggressive actions by the Russians. They are simply indefensible.
There have been well documented and recent incursions flights by Soviet (ooops) I mean Russian TU-95 aircraft into NORAD airspace.
That airspace includes the arctic.
A Tu-95 is capable of carrying tactical and strategic nuclear weapons.
Hardly the Easter bunny.
The same is happening in the UK. A recent NATO ministers meeting in Holland was interrupted as the Dutch scrambled f16's to intercept Russian aircraft that were flying way too close.

A US carrier group had a Russian bomber fly directly over the carrier at a very low altitude. The list goes on.
Why are the Russians doing this shit? It's exactly what they did when they were the CCCP.

The former Soviet republics ( I think they know a bit more about 'Mother Russia' than some back packing Canadian) are banding together to support Georgia. They don't seem to share your views of Russia, but hey, what would they know? They have endured Russian avarice on and off for 300 or so years and only managed to get the Russian boot off their necks in the 1990’s.

Really, I can't see a good reason why any peace-loving democrat could even support these aggressive actions by the Russians. They are simply indefensible.

Forgive me if I don't ROFL about the Russians, but you are quite free in this country to do that. Put Georgia on the list of countries that are not ROFL re Russia.

[C.M. Burns]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

C.M. Burns C.M. Burns:

tritium tritium:

Russia is getting to be a pain, from invading Georgia to invading Canada's arctic sovereignty.

Invading Canada's arctic sovereignty

Next you're going to tell us that they killed the Easter Bunny!!!

Really, I can't see a good reason why any peace-loving democrat could even support these aggressive actions by the Russians. They are simply indefensible.
There have been well documented and recent incursions flights by Soviet (ooops) I mean Russian TU-95 aircraft into NORAD airspace.
That airspace includes the arctic.
A Tu-95 is capable of carrying tactical and strategic nuclear weapons.
Hardly the Easter bunny.
The same is happening in the UK. A recent NATO ministers meeting in Holland was interrupted as the Dutch scrambled f16's to intercept Russian aircraft that were flying way too close.

A US carrier group had a Russian bomber fly directly over the carrier at a very low altitude. The list goes on.
Why are the Russians doing this shit? It's exactly what they did when they were the CCCP.

The former Soviet republics ( I think they know a bit more about 'Mother Russia' than some back packing Canadian) are banding together to support Georgia. They don't seem to share your views of Russia, but hey, what would they know? They have endured Russian avarice on and off for 300 or so years and only managed to get the Russian boot off their necks in the 1990’s.

Really, I can't see a good reason why any peace-loving democrat could even support these aggressive actions by the Russians. They are simply indefensible.

Forgive me if I don't ROFL about the Russians, but you are quite free in this country to do that. Put Georgia on the list of countries that are not ROFL re Russia.

Incursions by aircraft

That's hardly an invasion!

THe US or NATO or Britain doesn't run incursions of Russian airspace?
They don't fly over Russian naval vessels?
They don't carry nuclear weapons?

Please, you don't hear the Russians crying about an non-existent invasion!

[C.M. Burns]

Independent.co.uk

$1:

Mary Dejevsky: Russia the bad guys? Who are the West trying to kid?
Friday, 15 August 2008

As Russian forces started to hand over control of the Georgian town of Gori yesterday, you could detect a note of surprise, even disappointment, in many media reports. So the all-out Russian invasion of plucky little democratic Georgia might not be going to happen after all. Could it be that the bear was drawing in his claws?

Well, Russia did not have long to worry about losing its reputation as backyard bully. Within hours, the United States envoy to Georgia was spinning a whole new myth to the BBC about how it was only decisive US intervention – by which he presumably meant the warplanes laden with humanitarian aid by then ostentatiously parked at Tbilisi airport – that the mighty erstwhile Red Army had been turned back.

The many Georgians who had counted on more timely and robust assistance from their US protector surely laughed a bitter laugh. But there were signs, with the arrival of the US Secretary of State in Georgia, that this version was gaining hold. The story of this war, it seems, will be that the US faced down a snarling, expansionist Russia, and forced it to limp back to its lair.

This is a travesty. But it is only the latest and most glaring in a series of Western misrepresentations and misreadings of Russian intentions throughout this sorry episode. They began with the repeated references to Russian "aggression" and "invasion", continued through charges of intended "regime change", and culminated in alarmist reports about Russian efforts to bomb the east-west energy pipeline. None of this, not one bit of it, is true.

[EyeBrock]

Cartoon guy, show me any recent cases where Canadian, US or UK combat aircraft have either flown purposely into Russian airspace or flew directly over Russian naval aircraft.

Nice that you defend Russian aggression.
You remind me of this Serbian guy in my office who thinks Stalin was a good guy.

[Scape]

TBILISI, Georgia -- A Georgian official says a train carrying oil products has hit a mine and at least two tanker cars are burning. There are no immediate reports of casualties.

Second of three U.S. Navy warship carrying relief supplies to Georgia passed through Turkey's Canakkale Strait, also known as the Dardanelles, on Sunday. Another U.S. warship arrived in a Georgia's main Black Sea port of Batumi as Russia ignored Western demands to pull its remaining troops from the Caucasus country's heartland.

Russian soldiers have been accused of establishing a market in a rebel region of Georgia to sell clothes and electronic goods they looted during the invasion and occupation of the country's western regions.

[mustang7617]

the us has far 2 much 2 deal wit in iraq n speaking as a member of the US Navy we cannot allow ourselves 2 become 2 deeply involved wit georgia nor 2 become bogged down in a situation that can escalate dramatically wit russia remember just b/c the cold war is over does not mean there is no threat of nuclear war in some ways the endding of the cold war makes this threat all 2 real in that countries n their ppl r no longer takeing nuclear war with russia seriously. if the US gets 2 involved & the situation escalates beyond control than nuclear war is very possible also with multiple nations haveing nuclear weapons a limited nuclear war is very likely perhaps definate. But 1 thing is clear the US can not afford 2 get more involved than military advisers & supplies 1 other thing thats for dam sure yall anti-americans need 2 stop blameing the US everytime shit happens the US has done a hell of alot over the years for alot of ppl. its so easy for yall 2 judge when ur sitting in the comfort & safty of ur own home but its far different when ur out in the field. those who talk so much yet hav never been 2 war or done n seen the things we hav actually kno so very lil & need 2 stop acting like they kno so very much

[Regina]

wit = with
hav = have
kno = know
lil = little