[Newsbot]

Title: Muslim group moves to ban burka
Category: Misc CDN
Posted By: snookums
Date: 2009-10-07 18:07:48
Canadian

[mikewood86]

Right from the horses mouth. Maybe this will start elsewhere and people will see that the burka is a repressive symbol and not a religious one.

[mikewood86]

And who cares if only a minority of muslim women wear this. Better to ban it now before a majority of them start wearing it and it's out of control.

[Bacardi4206]

Wow, Muslim Group targets the burkas. Never thought I would see the day. Wish that group was in CKA so I can give them a clap.

The burka is a sign of repression against women. A medieval symbol. Glad some muslims are seeing it for what it really is.

[Public_Domain]

[BionicBunny]

I thought I was seeing a mirage but after rubbing my eyes twice and drinking some really powerful tea, it's still here.

Once I read the articles, I realized that despite the good intentions of this group, it is destined to die in Ottawa. The house of commons has to decide wether to allow gender equality over religious rights. From the track record I have seen, I am betting they'll allow religious freedom to reign over equality anyday. I mean, look at the rights over others Ottawa gives if you are a member of a certain race. Religion, I think is next in line for them before gender equality.

[Bodah]

BionicBunny BionicBunny:

I thought I was seeing a mirage but after rubbing my eyes twice and drinking some really powerful tea, it's still here.

Once I read the articles, I realized that despite the good intentions of this group, it is destined to die in Ottawa. The house of commons has to decide wether to allow gender equality over religious rights. From the track record I have seen, I am betting they'll allow religious freedom to reign over equality anyday. I mean, look at the rights over others Ottawa gives if you are a member of a certain race. Religion, I think is next in line for them before gender equality.

The burka has nothing/nothing to do with religon. AS stated in the article.
Dont believe take anything Mohamed Elmasry as a legitimate arguement either in this article, a balanced and fair mind is the last thing this person has.

This is the same nut who went to the Calgary police to have Ezra Levant arrested for publishing cartoons when that failed dragged him through the HRC for 3 years instead.


I applaud these Canadians. The burka is oppressive period and has no place here.

[Guy_Fawkes]

I dont know, Im not a fan of the burka by no means but doesnt this go against a person’s free speech? I say you should ban it for some situations when the identity of a person must be known government buildings, airports ect and if a business wants to have a sign up that would be fine too. I would love to see a sign that says No Burkas allowed. However an out and out ban of the garment is quite extreme, its still a personal choice and a personal expression.

[EyeBrock]

The burkah/niqab.

It's a 'fuck you western civilisation' statement. That's all.

[DerbyX]

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

The burkah/niqab.

It's a 'fuck you western civilisation' statement. That's all.

No it isn't. Its a religious dress code that predates western civilization by some thousand years.

Are you as harsh on hasidic jews? How about amish or mennoites. They too can be viewed as not wanting to fit in or truly become part of society at large.

Now if muslim groups are trying to get rid of it themselves then more power to them but the true "fuck you western society" is the loss of freedom banning it entails and the belief that not only should we ban it here but also travel to their countries and force them to adapt to our values.

That's the true threat to western freedoms and society.

[Brenda]

Guy_Fawkes Guy_Fawkes:

I dont know, Im not a fan of the burka by no means but doesnt this go against a person’s free speech? I say you should ban it for some situations when the identity of a person must be known government buildings, airports ect and if a business wants to have a sign up that would be fine too. I would love to see a sign that says No Burkas allowed. However an out and out ban of the garment is quite extreme, its still a personal choice and a personal expression.

I agree with every aspect of this post

[EyeBrock]

DerbyX DerbyX:

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

The burkah/niqab.

It's a 'fuck you western civilisation' statement. That's all.

No it isn't. Its a religious dress code that predates western civilization by some thousand years.

Are you as harsh on hasidic jews? How about amish or mennoites. They too can be viewed as not wanting to fit in or truly become part of society at large.

Now if muslim groups are trying to get rid of it themselves then more power to them but the true "fuck you western society" is the loss of freedom banning it entails and the belief that not only should we ban it here but also travel to their countries and force them to adapt to our values.

That's the true threat to western freedoms and society.

Derby, I disagree. I'm going on what I saw in the UK on my last visit, and what I had experienced in the 5 years I lived there for in the 1990's.

There has always been a large Asian (East Indian) population in Manchester and the area I worked was 70% Asian. I can't actually remember seeing a burka or niqab during that time. There was the odd hijab but that was about it. Even the Islamic Studies classes I took at Manchester Poly, it was rare to see even a hijab. Most Pakistani/Bangladeshi women either wore modest clothing or were wearing what all the fashionable Brit chicks were wearing.

I went back in 2007 and what a difference. The burka and niqab were everywhere. Muslims in the UK now actively marginalise themselves from English society and are very insular. This is a sea change in attitude.

Muslim women are now expected to show their devotion to Allah by donning the burka/niqab and it most certainly is a 'fuck you English society' in the UK.

This is what is happening all over the western world. Muslim immigrants (a large majority of them) are eschewing integration with their host nations and are actively showing their distaste for western society.

I can’t see how we can ban it but we should recognise the burka/niqab for what it is, an icon of radicalisation, not a religious choice.

[Brenda]

I read in the Dutch news that 25% of the worlds population is Muslim.

[DerbyX]

Its still not a "fuck you" just because people want to maintain a cultural identity. Like I said, are you as harsh over hasidic jews, amish, or mennonites? What about sikhs? I've seen turban wearing seeks not only playing hockey but refereeing it. Hell, my ferrets have had a turban wearing vet. Despite their insistence at wearing it they make every effort to fit in.

Lots of people can look like they fit in but don't simply because they haven't got any dress that makes them stand out (unless you count goths, punks, etc).

They have the right to wear what they want and baring things like drivers license and passports then they can wear what they hell they want as far as I'm concerned. Banning it hurts us more then them because freedom is what we cherish and banning it takes freedom away even if its not something you do.

We can't walk around town naked can we? The same reason "for the decorum of society" can be used for why its illegal to walk around naked for us and un-burkaed (sp?) for them.

Lets recognize what attempts top ban it really are and that's laws to restrict the freedom we cherish so dear in our society and that sets us apart from the societies you despise.

[BeaverFever]

you're both right. The origins of the burq/niqalb date back to pre-muslim arabia but it was never in as common practise as it is today.

There are many layers to this, the most basic answer is that a return to fundamentalist (not necessarily militant, mind you) beliefs in the muslim world has alot to do with political developments in the late 20th century. Namely, the soviet invasion of afghanistan and the western financing of militant islamist schools to fight that threat basically created an incubator for religious militarists.

At the same time, western backing of brutal secular dictators like the Shah and Saddam Hussein and the Saudi dynasty did much to alienate average muslims from secularism and the religious fundamentalists created to fight the communists found a new cause and became a monster that we could no longer control.

These chickens are coming home to roost as the products of that environment immigrate to western countries.

Add to that ongoing agitations in Israel, the rapid global spread of western culture, with its ever-increasing sexual content that offends religious folk everywhere, the rapid spread of consumer captialism that undermines traditional ways of living and rapidly changes the world under the feet of traditionalists and you have a backlash against the modern times, which happens to be dominated by western culture.

Now, we have rising anti-muslim sentiment in the west that creates a self-sustaining downward spiral, the more hostile we are towards muslim culture, the more alienated muslims in our nations become and the more they cling to their traditions and closed communities.

I dont think a business could or should have a 'no burqa policy' we need to stop trying to coerce people through threats and laws and start think of ways to partner with moderates and enourage cooperation. Social trends can be reversed, but not through force or hostility. Most Christians I know arent very religious and dont go to church except for the odd holiday or when grandma is in town but I guarantee you that if the govt tried to outlaw church, those same people would be packing the pews in a backlash and would become much more religious.

I dont know why anyone would claim surprise that some muslims are opposed to burqas, there are moderates, progressives and reformers in every religion and culture, I think the problem is that we tend to generalize and stereotype other groups too much. In fact, Im surprised that people here are surpised.