[Bruce_the_vii]

I certainly don't have military training or even much of an opinion. There's some military people here and they would have a proper comment. However their opinion will be the government should spend big on their field of interest. I certainly know that. If you say the per copy cost of the F-35 is $246 million over the plane's life time they'll wonder what your point is exactly.

[tritium]

Why would Canada need fighters anyhow, it's not like we have anything to defend.

Canada is pretty much foreign owned, just let those countries fight our battles, starting with the Arctic dispute with Russia.

[Bruce_the_vii]

tritium tritium:

Why would Canada need fighters anyhow, it's not like we have anything to defend.

Canada is pretty much foreign owned, just let those countries fight our battles, starting with the Arctic dispute with Russia.

[Bruce_the_vii]

Oh, yeah - don't forget, Ottawa bought the CF-5 at one point. I was a teenager at the time and the main stream media said it was a hot fighter. The military didn't know what to do with it. Eventual it was regulated to a reconnaise role, fitted with a camera.

[Unsound]

I hate that this has turned so political. I know basically nothing about fighter planes, and everything I know about the likely future needs of Canada's military is based on what I've read during the controversy over this. So basically not that much and most of it contradictory. I suspect that most people who are commenting on the issue and getting all worked up over are in the same boat, and most likely are simply parroting whatever "facts" they';ve heard that will most support their party of choice.

Why not just assume that the proffesionals at the Department of Defense know what they're talking about? They've been working on this since before the present government took power, so I'd assume their decision has llittle to nothing to do with political considerations.

[KorbenDeck]

Canadian_Mind Canadian_Mind:

, I don't see why alternatives to the F-35 can't be looked at, and why a competition can't be held.

Because the competition was held in 1996 and Lockheed Martin won.

[Bruce_the_vii]

Unsound, as I just posted the military don't actually make the decision. And they have no idea how much money is coming later for other equipment. They have no idea what the government will be asking them to do. The Air Force Generals will go for the most expensive equipment. They take what they can get. It is that political.

[Bruce_the_vii]

KorbenDeck KorbenDeck:

Canadian_Mind Canadian_Mind:

, I don't see why alternatives to the F-35 can't be looked at, and why a competition can't be held.

Because the competition was held in 1996 and Lockheed Martin won.

There's been talk on this board about the Super F-18. The thing is it'll cost too.

[Unsound]

Bruce_the_vii Bruce_the_vii:

Unsound, as I just posted the military don't actually make the decision. And they have no idea how much money is coming later for other equipment. They have no idea what the government will be asking them to do. The Air Force Generals will go for the most expensive equipment. They take what they can get. It is that political.

Of course the generals will ask for the world, but they have to justify their requests to the bureaucrats who hold the purse strings. Much as I'm sure we all hate bureaucrats I'm still pretty sure that the ones making these decisions are 100 times more qualified to do so than you or I are.

[saturn_656]

Bruce_the_vii Bruce_the_vii:

Oh, yeah - don't forget, Ottawa bought the CF-5 at one point. I was a teenager at the time and the main stream media said it was a hot fighter. The military didn't know what to do with it. Eventual it was regulated to a reconnaise role, fitted with a camera.

It was what Ottawa bought, but it also was not what the CF wanted (they wanted the F-4 Phantom).

The "Freedom Fighter" was a cheap low tech aircraft intended for export to countries unable to afford advanced fighter aircraft.

[Bruce_the_vii]

Unsound Unsound:

Bruce_the_vii Bruce_the_vii:

Unsound, as I just posted the military don't actually make the decision. And they have no idea how much money is coming later for other equipment. They have no idea what the government will be asking them to do. The Air Force Generals will go for the most expensive equipment. They take what they can get. It is that political.

Of course the generals will ask for the world, but they have to justify their requests to the bureaucrats who hold the purse strings. Much as I'm sure we all hate bureaucrats I'm still pretty sure that the ones making these decisions are 100 times more qualified to do so than you or I are.

I'm pesimistic. Bad decisions are made all the time be democratic governments. I'm not sure how they do this but it happens. Harper, for example, is talking about labour shortages in two years while his Finance Minister is cutting business taxes to stimulate job growth over the long term. Little things like that tell you the government is not ace organized.

[Unsound]

I agree that governments make do bad decisions, but as I said, in cases like this I feel like we really should trust the people who are qualified and who have put years of research into this. The more partisan politics that surrounds it the more likely they are to make bad decisions.

[BartSimpson]

Iggy's plan is to defund the CF and trust everyone in the world. Hey, it works for Costa Rica, right?

[DerbyX]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Iggy's plan is to defund the CF and trust everyone in the world. Hey, it works for Costa Rica, right?

Iggy's a warhawk. He is the most military minded Liberal in recent memory. He has no intention of defunding the military. Clearly he is responding to the polls and public support but he isn't against defence spending.

I've have always wanted your opinion on this:

Assuming the money spent on the F35 is static. What is better? 65 F35s or 180 F18Es? The super hornet can be produced here on license and is 1/3 the price and won't reduce the airforce to a strength equal to a single carrier wing.

Don't you think Canada would be better served by an aircraft we can afford to field in much greater numbers?

[Bruce_the_vii]

What the hell sort of question is that? During the Cold War they bought 130 F-18; they aren't in the market for 180 F-18Es now.