[BartSimpson]

Tricks Tricks:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

I agree, but they also face a lot of disadvantages. There are many states that won't allow them to be sold in that state, in order to protect the 'big 3' companies. Makes it tough to service the cars if you can't set up operations in the state.

I'm surprised that's legal.

Why? California bans all sorts of vehicles so it's only fair that other states get to set their own rules as well.

[Tricks]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Tricks Tricks:

I just priced out a model 3, it's a lot more than I realised. Base model is 60 grand canadian. Long range model AWD model is 70, performance is 85.

The base model they were promising was base $30k, AWD and range options would bring it to about $45k CAD.

So they've doubled it. The base on their website is RWD and no extended battery. And I think that was 30k USD. But that's still 40k CAD.

[Tricks]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Tricks Tricks:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

I agree, but they also face a lot of disadvantages. There are many states that won't allow them to be sold in that state, in order to protect the 'big 3' companies. Makes it tough to service the cars if you can't set up operations in the state.

I'm surprised that's legal.

Why? California bans all sorts of vehicles so it's only fair that other states get to set their own rules as well.

What cars have they banned?

[DrCaleb]

Tricks Tricks:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Tricks Tricks:

I just priced out a model 3, it's a lot more than I realised. Base model is 60 grand canadian. Long range model AWD model is 70, performance is 85.

The base model they were promising was base $30k, AWD and range options would bring it to about $45k CAD.

So they've doubled it. The base on their website is RWD and no extended battery. And I think that was 30k USD. But that's still 40k CAD.

They always had the $60k 'premium' model listed. They are producing it first in order to make up tooling costs. When they do that, they'll start making the 'standard' version.

https://electrek.co/2018/08/14/tesla-mo ... le-design/

[peck420]

We can make extremely efficient vehicles for pretty cheap.

Nobody would buy them, just like the last dozen startups that have tried...but we can do it.

The problem is consumers. They want new energy efficiency abilities, but they want it done in the same package. And some things just don't come easily together.

First step in switching to solar power? Reducing energy usage.

Cars are still at CD's in the mid 20's range...they hit 0.11 20 years ago, nobody liked the design. Frontal areas are still in the 25 sq foot range. Etc, etc.

Even the vaunted Tesla S is a shit show from an aerodynamic standpoint...I hope it is worth the front trunk.

[BartSimpson]

Tricks Tricks:

What cars have they (California) banned?

$1:

What is a 49 state vehicle?

Many vehicles are only certified to meet lesser federal emission standards, called "49-State" certified. Vehicles smog certified to California standards are referred to as "50-State" certified.

[Tricks]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Tricks Tricks:

What cars have they (California) banned?

$1:

What is a 49 state vehicle?

Many vehicles are only certified to meet lesser federal emission standards, called "49-State" certified. Vehicles smog certified to California standards are referred to as "50-State" certified.

I hadn't heard of that! I wish I could find a list of cars that fall under that rule. Most modern cars shouldn't be affected, and it looks like anything with more than 7500 miles just needs to pay a fee to register.

[DrCaleb]

Tricks Tricks:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

Tricks Tricks:

What cars have they (California) banned?

$1:

What is a 49 state vehicle?

Many vehicles are only certified to meet lesser federal emission standards, called "49-State" certified. Vehicles smog certified to California standards are referred to as "50-State" certified.

I hadn't heard of that! I wish I could find a list of cars that fall under that rule. Most modern cars shouldn't be affected, and it looks like anything with more than 7500 miles just needs to pay a fee to register.

Every car I've ever seen for sale (new) carries the CARB certification. Most aftermarket parts too. Seems kind of silly to design your product out of one of the largest markets in the world.

[PublicAnimalNo9]

Thanos Thanos:

Both GM and Chrysler paid back in full the government bail-out money they were given back in 2009.

Really? Then why did Trudeau and Morneau forgive $3.7 billion in loans to Chrysler and GM in June of this year?

[Coach85]

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

Thanos Thanos:

Both GM and Chrysler paid back in full the government bail-out money they were given back in 2009.

Really? Then why did Trudeau and Morneau forgive $3.7 billion in loans to Chrysler and GM in June of this year?

They wrote off 1.1 billion for Chrysler. Nothing for GM. They had stock in GM and sold that stock.

[Thanos]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Tesla is a car company created in the last decade out of thin air. I expect there to be problems. But they get worked out. GM is more than 100 years old. Their problem is they haven't been very agile. That's why Tesla is taking their market away.

Not to mention at the same time, the guy created a Space launch company and a rapid transit company also out of thin air. No wonder he acts like an ass, the guy probably doesn't sleep.

If Musk's ideas pay off in the long term he'll be seen as another Henry Ford or Thomas Edison. The quirks and assholery those kind of people have become small potatoes compared to their overall legacy of changing the world.

[herbie]

$1:

Every car I've ever seen for sale (new) carries the CARB certification

Cuz we;re Canadians, use the California specs. And there's probably some states still classifying EVs as low speed vehicles or something, just as there's others with stupid rules banning RHD vehicles.
And other stupid things like hiding behind Imperial system nuts and bolts.

Plus: shake your heads. Tesla had no intention of going after the Nissan Micra, Ford Focus or even Camry market. They're aiming for people who buy BMW and Acura and wouldn't touch a $30,000 car with a 10 foot pole. Any of you been to a car lot lately? $30K won't get you much!

2018 Buick Enclave Premium
$52,995

2018 Buick Encore Premium
$39,960

2018 Jeep Wrangler New Car Rubicon|4x4|Hard Top|Navi|Backup Cam|Bluet 2 door
$56,780


2018 Lexus RX 350 8
$62,900

[Thanos]

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

Thanos Thanos:

Both GM and Chrysler paid back in full the government bail-out money they were given back in 2009.

Really? Then why did Trudeau and Morneau forgive $3.7 billion in loans to Chrysler and GM in June of this year?

I corrected myself on this error a few pages back, *You Handsome guy, you*.

[N_Fiddledog]

Thanos Thanos:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

Tesla is a car company created in the last decade out of thin air. I expect there to be problems. But they get worked out. GM is more than 100 years old. Their problem is they haven't been very agile. That's why Tesla is taking their market away.

Not to mention at the same time, the guy created a Space launch company and a rapid transit company also out of thin air. No wonder he acts like an ass, the guy probably doesn't sleep.

If Musk's ideas pay off in the long term he'll be seen as another Henry Ford or Thomas Edison. The quirks and assholery those kind of people have become small potatoes compared to their overall legacy of changing the world.

Tesla exists because of subsidies. Without them it wouldn't.

[Thanos]

So?