[bootlegga]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

bootlegga bootlegga:

Mexico isn't all bad - I hit Cabo San Lucas and Puerto Vallarta with the family last Christmas and it was pretty safe. No doubt more so because of the trucks full of heavily armed troops driving around each town.

Wow. Didn't know they'd deployed troops in those two spots. That sucks. PV and Cabo have mostly avoided the drama in the other cities and I agree that they're reportedly safe. I'm glad you had a good time, too!

In fairness I didn't get a good look at their uniforms - I just saw a couple Chevy pick-ups painted in camo (kind of like the MILCOTS we use), armed with a 50 cal and half a dozen troops with assault rifles in the back each time. For all I know they could have just been heavily armed police - although neither truck had anything like La Policia scrawled on the side.

In Cabo, we just went to the beach and had to deal with about thousand or so hawkers selling trinkets. The best part of the trip was renting a jetski for 45 minutes ($40). That was a hoot blasting all over the bay, tooling around the cruise ships and jumping waves - made me feel like I was 20 again! I have to say, it's a must for anyone who has the chance!

In Puerto, we went on a tour of the town - which included 'famous' sights and a tour of a tequila factory. Let me tell you, the stuff they make there is way better than Jose Cuervo or any other tequila you can buy here! No burning aftertaste, just a smooth ride all the way down, and it came in a variety of flavours - almond, chocolate, coffee and of course, normal (clear or gold colour).

After hearing so many horror stories about Mexico, it was a delight. I'd love to go to Cancun (mostly to see Mayan Ruins) someday, but the atmosphere there is geared towards 20 year olds, not families - so I don't know if I'll ever go.

[2Cdo]

bootlegga bootlegga:

After hearing so many horror stories about Mexico, it was a delight. I'd love to go to Cancun (mostly to see Mayan Ruins) someday, but the atmosphere there is geared towards 20 year olds, not families - so I don't know if I'll ever go.

About an hour south of Cancun is Tulum. Dreams is a nice resort and easy access to several different ruin sites. Went there a about 8 years ago and had a great time.

[bootlegga]

2Cdo 2Cdo:

bootlegga bootlegga:

After hearing so many horror stories about Mexico, it was a delight. I'd love to go to Cancun (mostly to see Mayan Ruins) someday, but the atmosphere there is geared towards 20 year olds, not families - so I don't know if I'll ever go.

About an hour south of Cancun is Tulum. Dreams is a nice resort and easy access to several different ruin sites. Went there a about 8 years ago and had a great time.

I'm a huge history buff and would love to see Tulum. I'd also add Copan (Honduras) and Tikal (Guatemala), but I'd never take my family to backwoods places like those.

I guess I'll have to be content with looking at them on the Internet.

[2Cdo]

bootlegga bootlegga:

I'm a huge history buff and would love to see Tulum. I'd also add Copan (Honduras) and Tikal (Guatemala), but I'd never take my family to backwoods places like those.

I guess I'll have to be content with looking at them on the Internet.

Not too expensive and well worth it.

[BartSimpson]

2Cdo 2Cdo:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

2Cdo 2Cdo:

As a shooter, who is an excellent shot on the range, I admit that when there is someone shooting back I am far from an excellent shot.

The trick here is to shoot first and thereby avoid that whole, messy, 'shooting back' business.

If only it always worked out that way.

True. Still, shooting the bad guys first is the best way to prevent them from shooting back.

[Xort]

raydan raydan:

One of the arguments here is that all gun owners are excellent shots that would have no problems taking down the shooter. The problem with that argument is that the shooter is also a gun owner.

Very few criminals practice with a firearm.
Although when they do it can be very deadly.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Norway_attacks
~
For all the comments about how it's easy when no one is shooting back, please remember the only people shooting were the police. The killer only fired to kill the guy he set out to murder. When the police started shooting he was not returning any fire.

It might be more correct to say, when you are excited it can be hard to do fine motor skills with accuracy. Which is why most military weapons training is repeated so many times, so that when it comes to a real fight your body will know what it needs to do without your mind trying to actively control your movements. I will suggest the police don't dedicate as much time to learning and practicing their pistols as they do to other police skills.

I doubt I will ever forget how to work a C6 (FN MAG).
~
Bystanders were hit with bullets and bullet fragments, not just with fragments.

What the police did was a close to a mag dump. Getting as many shots off as they did as fast as they did is how you miss your target from less than 3m. You can watch a rather poor video of the shooting but it doesn't add much as it's damn short and kinda blurry.

Again I will suggest the solution is a heavier longer weapon that uses two hands well spaced apart. Semi automatic fire with a pistol round is very controlable in a PDW or SMG. But they are larger, take up more space, look scary (to people that let their feelings do the thinking), cost more, may get in the way more often when trying to do other types of police work.

It is possible to be a very good pistol shooter, but it take time and dedication. For the number of times the police kill or hurt bystandards it might be better to have them out on the streets rather than at a range working towards being safer.

[Gunnair]

Gunnair Gunnair:

Xort Xort:

Update: It is reported that all the people wounded were hurt by the police, and the shooter they killed wasn't shooting at the police when they shot him (he did try to draw his gun on them, or maybe pointed it at them, which would be more than enough justification to kill him in my mind).

That last report I read said the police started shooting from about 8 feet away.

They fired 14 rounds. The dead man had 10 bullet wounds, which 3 were suggested to be exit wounds.

So they managed to hit the guy 50% of the time from 8 feet away.

What's your average?

So again, what's your average?

[raydan]

Xort Xort:

raydan raydan:

One of the arguments here is that all gun owners are excellent shots that would have no problems taking down the shooter. The problem with that argument is that the shooter is also a gun owner.

Very few criminals practice with a firearm.

Do you have a link to back that up or are you pulling stats out of your ass?