[Bruce_the_vii]

This time it's wind energy. Wind energy is an established technology with several world players already. Wind energy is not particularly suited to Ontario as the only areas of steady wind are N. of Lake Erie and N. of Lake Superior. Yet he has now dreamed up a vast investment program for it. This is while he has a $25 billion deficit he has no idea what to do about.

http://www.thestar.com/news/ontario/art ... -deal?bn=1

[Bruce_the_vii]

The comments section are heavily negative, see this as McGuinty spending which is a relieve to me.

[Ash1980]

Yes Our beloved Premier is going to save us all again with His ability too invest Our money that We will soon have less of into technology that will create jobs So Our Children can give Their Money too pay for the deficit He cannot fix or find enough people to blame for.
I am not being a prick I think this is a good idea but I am tired of McGuinty using soft politics to try and get people forget He did indeed lie several times about raising taxes.Usually He attacks smokers but the only thing He can do to them now is stop the native smokes We all know He will not do for fear of starting something He does not have to stomach to finish around the Six Nations reserve.I understand restate is a bargin there right now.

[PublicAnimalNo9]

Yep, whatever you do McGuinty, don't invest locally. How about investing in ATS's solar energy program and providing incentives for home owners to buy solar power equipment, thusly REDUCING the dependency ON the grid?
Oh yeah, he wants to make sure that any hydro provided will still be dependent on the grid so he can tax us for hydro USAGE and NOT just for the service.

This is how fucked up government is. BAck in the day when Ontario still owned Ontario Hydro, the Chrysler mini-van plant in Windsor generated their own hydro.
When they petitioned the provincial gov't to allow them to go off the grid and operate on their own power production, they were told to go ahead but would STILL be billed as if they were using Ontario hydro. Their rationale being, it could lead to the deregualtion of the hydro industry in Ontario. Well, 20 something years later and here we are, deregulated hydro and all.
None of that was McGuinty's fault mind you, but he's keeping right in line with stupid decisions made by Ontario premiers.

[dino_bobba_renno]

Why would McGuinty off shore this when there is AAER right next door in Quebec? Kind of strange to bring in South Koreans when there are Canadian companies that are more than capable of doing this.

[Bruce_the_vii]

Wither Dalton McGuinty? Will he announce a couple of more spending initiatives and then pass the leadership and his fiscal mess to another leader? The Ontario deficit, at $25 billion, is 1.3 the relative size of the federal deficit. If growth is a robust 3% we will grow out of the federal deficit but not the Ontario deficit.

[BeaverFever]

What you should know about the gov't rush to invest in "green industries" and "green jobs":

1) This is in anticipation of a "cap and trade" or "carbon credit" market, in which carbon credits become financial intruments to be invested in, traded, speculated upon, bundled into derivatives, etc etc by the same people who brought you the subprime meltdown. Its not a coincedence that McGuinty announced this "green jobs" deal at the Toronto Stock Exchange instead of some Union hall or Envrionmental Organization. This is still the old finance capitalism we've been living in for the past couple of decades, not some environmental activism. The hope is that the TSX will become a centre of such trading if "carbon credits" are generated here through so-called "green" industries. Whether this investment provides value for the amount of jobs or energy created is secondary. There will be carbon credits generated here available for investment on the TSX. Take note, global investors.

2)You may ask yourself, why is there a scramble to manufacture green technologies here, if we've already seen that any manufacturing activity can be off-shored? The hope is that if you can lure a company from a "new" technology sector to come here and build a new factory, it will stay here longer than "old" industries that already have established infrastructure and resources abroad in developing countries. Obviously, they'll all head offshore at some point, but the reasoning is that newer technologies will have greater incentive to stay and that this can be capitalised upon to build up a technology and expertise cluster for that industry's cutting edge research and development.

[CommanderSock]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

What you should know about the gov't rush to invest in "green industries" and "green jobs":

1) This is in anticipation of a "cap and trade" or "carbon credit" market, in which carbon credits become financial intruments to be invested in, traded, speculated upon, bundled into derivatives, etc etc by the same people who brought you the subprime meltdown. Its not a coincedence that McGuinty announced this "green jobs" deal at the Toronto Stock Exchange instead of some Union hall or Envrionmental Organization. This is still the old finance capitalism we've been living in for the past couple of decades, not some environmental activism. The hope is that the TSX will become a centre of such trading if "carbon credits" are generated here through so-called "green" industries. Whether this investment provides value for the amount of jobs or energy created is secondary. There will be carbon credits generated here available for investment on the TSX. Take note, global investors.

2)You may ask yourself, why is there a scramble to manufacture green technologies here, if we've already seen that any manufacturing company can be off-shored? The hope is that if you can lure a company from a "new" technology sector to come here and build a new factory, it will stay here longer than "old" industries that already have established infrastructure and resources abroad in developing countries. Obviously, they'll all head offshore at some point, but the reasoning is that newer technologies will have greater incentive to stay and that this can be capitalised upon to build up a technology and expertise cluster for that industry's cutting edge research and development.

The Engineering here is far more superior to anything that could be found in Asia (that includes Japan).

However labour costs are prohibitive.

[Bruce_the_vii]

I've heard government medling in the economy, trying to pick winners and generate new industrial clusters, called "steal a cluster".

[martin14]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

What you should know about the gov't rush to invest in "green industries" and "green jobs":

1) This is in anticipation of a "cap and trade" or "carbon credit" market, in which carbon credits become financial intruments to be invested in, traded, speculated upon, bundled into derivatives, etc etc by the same people who brought you the subprime meltdown. Its not a coincedence that McGuinty announced this "green jobs" deal at the Toronto Stock Exchange instead of some Union hall or Envrionmental Organization. This is still the old finance capitalism we've been living in for the past couple of decades, not some environmental activism. The hope is that the TSX will become a centre of such trading if "carbon credits" are generated here through so-called "green" industries. Whether this investment provides value for the amount of jobs or energy created is secondary. There will be carbon credits generated here available for investment on the TSX. Take note, global investors.

2)You may ask yourself, why is there a scramble to manufacture green technologies here, if we've already seen that any manufacturing activity can be off-shored? The hope is that if you can lure a company from a "new" technology sector to come here and build a new factory, it will stay here longer than "old" industries that already have established infrastructure and resources abroad in developing countries. Obviously, they'll all head offshore at some point, but the reasoning is that newer technologies will have greater incentive to stay and that this can be capitalised upon to build up a technology and expertise cluster for that industry's cutting edge research and development.

1) anticipating something that nay or may not happen anytime soon,
and if / when it does, it will be in a shape completely different from
whats being discussed now.

Fantastic, more usual pie in the sky BS.


2) Big thanks for supporting Canadian companies.
I have had the displeasure of dealing with Samsung over here.
Suffice to say I do not do business with this company,
by my own choice. I get asked every few months to put an offer together,
I dont bother anymore.

To whoever will have to deal with Samsung, all I can say is enjoy the pain.

[Bruce_the_vii]

The coming Cap and Trade program? Good point. Only McGuinty should be supporting the Canadian nuclear program, the CANDU. Instead he opened up the possibility of Ontario buying foreign reactors and then demanded the nuclear companies pay for cost over runs - which are usually passed on to consumers. So the nuclear program has been put on hold.

McGuinty is Big Man politician, as was Harris. Ontario is going to be a Green Energy sector, ding ding, open the door to 1 million immigrants so we have the labour to fill these jobs.

[BeaverFever]

martin14 martin14:

1) anticipating something that nay or may not happen anytime soon,
and if / when it does, it will be in a shape completely different from
whats being discussed now.

Fantastic, more usual pie in the sky BS.

There already are carbon credit markets out there, they're just not very big or sophisticated or integrated yet since governments are only now starting to get involved. But a massive, if not world-wide, "cap and trade" system is coming in the near future, if not during Obama's term then soon afterwards. The whole "green jobs" thing is not a lefto-idea anymore, its mainstream for the simple reason that financial interests on Wall Street want to make tons of money on it. Personally, I have my doubts about its environmental benefits....thats something we'll have to wait on and see. But the system is coming.

[Bruce_the_vii]

The net effect of cap and trade will be negligable over the long term. It wont be popular what oil shoots above $149 a bbl. Most politicians can't even control themselves let alone the planet's climate.

[Bruce_the_vii]

Beaver has a good point. I shouldn't be such a dismissive smartie pants. If the world's politicians go for the cap and trade it'll cause some heavy spending. So that's an opportunity for someone.