[whelan costen]

How about not spending money on the bogus BMD and instead invest in what Canada needs in military, according to our plan and not a foreign powers agenda? Write to Graham, and when you do make sure you copy to others, like Layton, Harper, Martin etc, that way they can't say they didn't get it.

[z_whalen]

I agree, spending money on BMD is not the right thing to be doing right now. Star Wars is a relic of the cold war. I don't see Canada or even the US facing a ballistic missile attack anytime soon. But what I want to find out is what we can do to get people interested in the military again. I see this as an urgent issue that must be addressed immediately. We need to get Canadians to support increased military funding. That's the hard part.

[Stymiest]

[QUOTE BY= Crankster] Oh shit,get off the Arrow.It was a British design first. <br /> If we are to have any military,the gov boys better start soon. <br /> According to friends who serve,the military,such as it is,is almost non-existent in some of its faucetts.Moral sucks and most equipment is old and outdated(post WWII) <br /> Our militayr system needs to be revamped from the inside out people if we even hope to present a "peace-keeping force" of any strenght or dependability[/QUOTE] <br /> <br />My thoughts exactly Crankster

[Crankster]

As a boy on the prairies,I spent some time in Army Cadets.At that time,Cadets were a thrilling thing to be in. <br /> We spent a bit of time on CFB Dundurn,training with the Canadian military.Even at that time,early seventies,the equipment and munitions,the armament,uniforms,were old. <br /> We got the fun of target shooting with the C1F1A1 machine gun.What fun! Now,I think,those poor smucks,going up against AK47s,M-16s and the like are hopelessly outgunned. <br /> My point being that if it wasn't right then,how much needs to change now?Anyone in their right mind wouldn't join the army just for that. <br /> Another little story my grandfather told me.When they were stationed in France,the Allied forces had one bigcamp with a main road serving it.Each squadron or platoon had a pass word if they were out after dark on R&R or ops,whatever. <br /> Being Allies,they had French troops,English Troops,Scots,Dutch,etc.Each one,of course had an easily defined password,put together with the varied accents,it was easy fore the sentry to assertain who was friend or foe.When it came to Canadians,two simple words were often said,F*** You.Canadian forces never had much trouble being intimidated by other Allied Forces or by the enemy for that matter. <br /> It makes me wonder what the intimidation factor is like now,always having to piggyback with the Americans.

[canuck]

Here's my suggestion... <br /> <br />SLASH the budget for the DND and especially the NDHQ. I mean, these military bureaucracies have so much fat to trim, cutting the money going directly to them couldn't be anything but beneficial.

[z_whalen]

I agree, the military needs to cut down on bureaucracy. The first step should be taking the civilians out of the DND and the NDHQ, then we can think about slashing the budget.

[Stymiest]

[QUOTE BY= Canuck] Here's my suggestion... <br /> <br />SLASH the budget for the DND and especially the NDHQ. I mean, these military bureaucracies have so much fat to trim, cutting the money going directly to them couldn't be anything but beneficial.[/QUOTE] <br /> <br />As I had stated in my own post Bureaucracy is one of the main contributing factors behind our military's decline. People are being promoted when they shouldn't be and we have people who are running the show down at DND who know nothing about how the military is supposed to function.

[Crankster]

Ok,your're both right.The DND NDHQ have to be trimmed.I bet you a zilion dollars,if and when that happens,the monies saved will go someplace else.Probably into our Governor Generals suite of rooms,or into fisheries credit card payments,or even the States as protection money.It certainly won't go back into the military given the track record of decisions within the present gov.

[whelan costen]

I don't think the budget needs trimming, but allocation needs revision! Public disclosure of funding, and if I remember correctly an article on vive, where several million dollars were unaccounted for, start there, start spending on our military, not BMD, not funding foreign powers agendas and stop wasting on the b.s.

[Crankster]

Thats what I was sarcasticaly saying.The budget will get reviewed,slashed,whatever.Some smart egghead will say the money would be better spent on longunderware for thew guys stationed in the desert or some stupid thing.

[canuck]

[QUOTE BY= whelan costen] I don't think the budget needs trimming, but allocation needs revision! Public disclosure of funding, and if I remember correctly an article on vive, where several million dollars were unaccounted for, start there, start spending on our military, not BMD, not funding foreign powers agendas and stop wasting on the b.s.[/QUOTE] <br /> <br />Absolutely true, Catherine. Having any amount of money spent by the government and especially the military suddenly being unaccounted for should not be tolerated like it is in the US. And I also agree with the sentiment previously expressed that computerization should be restricted within the CF. I believe the purchasing of computerized or digitized (whatever people want to call it) military hardware is reponsible for spiralling costs when all that money spent on superfluous technology would do more good if it was used to purchase the consumable goods and reliable equipment that we really need. I mean, really what good is having a computerized rifle? Is it for people who are poor marksmans and how does that alleviate the supply shortage in the CF?

[z_whalen]

Umm, what about computerized targeting systems for missiles and digital reconaissance equipment for better intelligence. People obviously hate it when we hit a building full of innocent civilians by accident. Technology is one of the things our military needs to bring it up to date. Much of our equipment needs to be refitted or replaced to meet today's standard of warfare. In a small military like Canada's, technology is key. You can't cut technology out to make room for supplies, and you can't cut off supplies to buy more technology. What our military needs is spending money for both.

[Crankster]

Computerized targeting systems etal!What about vehicles to put them in?What about troop transport?What about the basics of war,if thier is such athing. <br /> This country will always kiss the American ass unless we establish a manufacturing core capable of supporting our own army!

[z_whalen]

I don't think there's anything wrong with purchasing military vehicles and technology from other countries as long as you get it for the right price. We got some subs from the UK and contrary to popular belief they will be capable of incorporating into our fleets. Germany is supposedly willing to sell a lighter version of their Leopard 2 battle tanks: something we should definetly capitalize on, seeing as how effective American tanks were in Iraq (they may have been there for the wrong reasons, but I'll be damned if they weren't effective). This does not mean we should stop manufacturing at home. A boost in military manufacturing could create some new jobs and boost our economy a little. What we need is a combination of new vehicles and new technology, some of it home produced at home and some imported from abroad. This is why our forces need increase funds.

[z_whalen]

Oh yah and building up our military with the sole purpose of pissing off America is a bad idea. I think we have better things to do.