[Dr Caleb]

I think you've got it all bass-ackwards. SARS, West Nile, ebola. Those are the things they will be fighting.<p> By your logic, the Department of Transportation is in charge of street racing.<p>

[Milton]

Oh yea, where did SARS come from, and Ebola and aids? We know for a fact what we are dealing with here do we? We just seem to have lost total control over every aspect of our civilization but lets not suggest that something is wrong? <p>We have evidence every day that our elected officials are trying to sell us out to MNC's, not to mention all the things we are exposed to because they stopped requiring proof of safety. They want to spray nerve gases all over the place to kill insects which may or may not carry a disease. Never mind the damage that the nerve gas causes to humans and all other organisms, yea I am familiar with the logic. But, we are to believe that they mean well when they open up this center of theirs. I don't trust anything that they do and I don't understand why anyone would.

[Dr Caleb]

Diseases mutate all the time. It's a natural product of evolution. Why are people at risk of getting the Flu or a cold every year, even though they got it last year and now have an immunity to it? Because it mutates and adapts in order to prolong it's survival. Every once in a while, someone with the flu eats an animal with another type of flu, and something like SARS or Ebola jumps out. That's what this center is going to do - study the way things mutate and find ways to combat them. It's going to hopefully prevent things like the SARS outbreak last year, and what's going to happen when something like the avain flu jumps to humans? It spreads rapidly, and what if that human has SARS? Will we have a fast spreading deadly variant of SARS? How do we stop it then?<p> <i>I don't trust anything that they do and I don't understand why anyone would.</i><p> I realize some people are naturally suspicious of anything the government does, and that isn't a bad thing. I know too many microbiologists and immunologists to assume they have any intent other than the public well being. Things like I've described above scare them as much as they scare us, but they have the knowledge to do something about it.<p> People infected with West Nile, 80% of the time don't even know it. 1% of the time it become a serious problem. Same for SARS. It took 40(?) people last year? Compare that to, say, people dying from undercooked hamburger - eColi infections - about 200 people died from last year.<p> Smallpox and polio used to be a far greater threat to humanity than West Nile or SARS ever will be, but it was the dedication of people like this group in Winnipeg that wiped them from the face of the earth. "Never attribute to malice what can be more easily explained through stupidity" <p>

[Milton]

Neither polio or smallpox has been eradicated from the world, it may be that smallpox was kept as a biological weapon but it is still with us, witness the small outbreaks in Africa in recent years. Polio appears to have been caused primarily by the improper treatment of sewage and secondarily by polio vaccinations. A google search using either name will tell the tale. <p>The point is that we are on a fascist highway, everything is being fast tracked for the coming strait jacketing of Western societies. The ruling class does not need us anymore. We have invented the machinery which can do the jobs that we formerly had to do. Now they have to figure out how to dispense with us. A nice little outbreak of something or other might do the trick. The old "Jim Jones" take this, it is good for you ploy. <p>When you grow up in society like ours, where the truth is hidden and lies are the commandments you are educated with, any actions taken have to be scrutinized with unrelenting fervor because we are ignorant and therefore our own worst enemies.

[Kory Yamashita]

Y'know, a lot of these diseases don't really need to be cured in the first place. Polio's caused primarily by improper sewage treatment? Well TREAT THE SEWAGE. Avian flu is from poultry? Well stop eating birds that were raised in cages that are only 20% bigger than they are. Same goes for Mad Cow. </p> A lot of these diseases that we're supposed to be so afraid of are the result of too many people in too little space eating whatever is most economical. I enjoy eating and I enjoy not wallowing in my own fecal matter, and so I make an effort, even at increased cost, to eat cleaner foods where possible and to... use a toilet. </P> More importantly, but MUCH more costly in terms of $$$, than micro-bio research, would be a rebuilding of our economic structure so that food of quality rather than quantity could be widely available. </p> I'd rather have free-range organic food for the rest of my life than an SUV for the next 10 years. Or coffee for one (take a look at farming coffee... it REALLY does a number on the rainforest, not to mention its probable role in the cocaine money shuffling). </p> This new public health agency is just another boom and bust, drag a broom behind your dumptruck as you whip around corners so fast that everything falls out kind of attitude. We wouldn't need so much "disaster relief" if we didn't cause so many disasters through global warming, poor hygiene (in crops, raising animals, etc), and under-researched "development". </p> Milton's right that this is a sign of a sick society. Dr. Caleb's right that the scientists working on this project have good intentions. It's the politicians who are using this "damage control" to save their image even as they allow the undermining of our entire society through de-regulation, "free" trade, etc.

[Reverend Blair]

You should all read "Darwin's Radio" by Greg Bear...nothing to do with the subject really, but it shows how diseases can be very political.

I think we need this place, but not for the political reasons being given. We're well overdue for some devastating outbreaks, there's and AIDs pandemic in Africa, and new diseases are emerging all the time. In addition to that, global warming will very likely bring some old diseases to Canada...things like dengue fever and malaria. Diseases have been known to mutate when they enter new environments. We need some defense against that.

I'm afraid this center will just be a branch office for the CDC in Atlanta though. That's a political issue, not a medical one. Support the science, but be very wary of the politicians who fund it.

[Kory Yamashita]

Disease is mother nature's way of keeping population in check. If you look at the population growth in the last century, it's pretty obvious that human population is in disequilibrium with its surroundings. We can keep pumping ourselves full of genetically modified wheats and meats, keep popping those anti-biotics, keep driving those SUV's. But equilibrium tends to work like an elastic; the further we push mother nature beyond equilibrium, the more violent the snap-back will be. I'm not sure I want to witness the starvation of billions when the soil can no longer sustain the crops. </P> Don't get me wrong -- I don't want to see people dying of west nile, ebola, mad cow, or avian flu either. But I think this concept of perpetual growth, both in population and in economy, deserves some inspection. Or, left unchecked, it can simply wipe us out.

[FootPrints]

(Here is an interesting article)<br /> <br /> <b>The Avian Flu Fright: Politically Timed for Global "Iatrogenocide"</b><br /> A Public Health Warning and Political Essay<br /> <br /> If avian flu becomes more than a threatened pandemic, it will have done so by political and economic design. This thesis is supported by current massive media misrepresentations, profiteering on risky and valueless vaccines, gross neglect of data evidencing earlier similar man-made plagues including SARS, West Nile Virus, AIDS and more; continuance of genetic studies breeding more mutant flu viruses likely to outbreak, inside trading scandals involving pandemic savvy White House and drug industry officials, curious immunity of these pharmaceutical entities over the past century to law enforcement and mainstream media scrutiny, and published official depopulation objectives. With the revelations and assertions advanced herein, the public is forewarned against this physician-assisted mass murder best termed "iatrogenocide."* This genocidal imposition is expected to serve mainly economic and political depopulation objectives. <br /> <br /> Background<br /> <br /> In April, 2003, a social experiment called SARS, said to have arrived from Asia, heavily struck Toronto. I was there throughout most of this Asian flu-foreshadowing fright. This bizarre new pneumonia-like illness was named Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome. It was said to be the latest threat in an ongoing series of attacks on humanity by mysteriously mutating "supergerms." <br /> <br /> A careful study of the scientific and medical-sociological correlates and antecedents of this "outbreak" revealed something amiss far more insidious than SARS. I critically considered Toronto's media reaction as any Harvard-trained public health expert in media persuasion behavioral science might. The scourge had all the earmarks of a novel social experiment conducted by white-collar bioterrorist. <br /> <br /> It seemed clear to me that this unprecedented population manipulation effectively indoctrinated the mass mind in support of a grossly ineffective, albeit legislated, public health response in advance of the arrival of "the Big One." Throughout the "SARS Scam,"(1) repeated references were made to biological agents that might facilitate decimation of approximately a third to half of the world's population. Having extensively reviewed political population control literature and contemporary objectives of leading global industrialists, I noted these predictions were in close keeping with current official population reduction objectives.(<br /> <br /> (2) Canada's response to SARS in 2003 was, for the first time in history, directed by the United Nations and World Health Organization (WHO). Having reviewed the intimate financial and administrative ties between these organizations, the Rockefeller family, Carnegie Foundation, and the world's leading drug makers, "the fox," in essence, reigned over Canada's "chickens." <br /> <br /> The truth about plagues includes the fact that "no grand pandemic ever evolved divorced from major socio-political upheaval." SARS advanced a political agenda more than a public health emergency. If public health officials earnestly intended to prevent these new emerging diseases, or successfully treat them at their roots, I repeated, they would study their obvious origins from the merged military-medical-biotechnology arena. A basic course in medical sociology simply justifies this utilitarian counsel. <br /> <br /> "Experts" had been predicting the arrival of a super-plague for decades. What was HIGHLY SUSPICIOUS about the mysterious and terrifying arrival of SARS, however, was its timing. It synchronously arrived with the global war on terrorism, and the Anglo-American war with Iraq. It seemed a convenient distraction from the fact that the earlier Bush administration had shipped Saddam Hussein most of his deadly biological weapons arsenal including anthrax and West Nile Virus. <br /> <br /> SARS was pathognomonic ( i.e., symptomatic and characteristic) of what I had predicted and explained in the book, Death in the Air: Globalism, Terrorism and Toxic Warfare (Tetrahedron Publishing Group, 2001; http://www.healthyworlddistributing.com/), a prophetically-titled text that predated the 9-11 attacks on America by several months, and provided a contextual analysis of certain globalists' links to recent "outbreaks." <br /> <br /> <a href="http://www.bangladesh-web.com/news/view.php?hidDate=2005-11-12&hidType=HIG&hidRecord=0000000000000000070510">continued</a><br /> <br />

[Perturbed]

[QUOTE BY= Milton] Oh yea, where did SARS come from, and Ebola and aids? We know for a fact what we are dealing with here do we? We just seem to have lost total control over every aspect of our civilization but lets not suggest that something is wrong?<br /> <br /> <p>We have evidence every day that our elected officials are trying to sell us out to MNC's, not to mention all the things we are exposed to because they stopped requiring proof of safety. They want to spray nerve gases all over the place to kill insects which may or may not carry a disease. Never mind the damage that the nerve gas causes to humans and all other organisms, yea I am familiar with the logic. But, we are to believe that they mean well when they open up this center of theirs. I don't trust anything that they do and I don't understand why anyone would. [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> You'd have to be more specific about what nerve gas. If it was a typical pesticide, it would be toxic when sprayed along roadsides, but it would depend on how much exposure humans got.<br /> <br /> They have also used pesticides in storm sewers to reduce breeding of mosquitoes. In areas where people live, this is not that big a deal although it is paranoid. People would likely only comeinto contact with the stuff were they to walk through it as it tends to stick to vegetation--unless it is windy or rainy.<br /> <br />

[Perturbed]

[QUOTE BY= FootPrints] (Here is an interesting article)<br /> <br /> <b>The Avian Flu Fright: Politically Timed for Global "Iatrogenocide"</b><br /> A Public Health Warning and Political Essay<br /> <br /> If avian flu becomes more than a threatened pandemic, it will have done so by political and economic design. This thesis is supported by current massive media misrepresentations, profiteering on risky and valueless vaccines, gross neglect of data evidencing earlier similar man-made plagues including SARS, West Nile Virus, AIDS and more; continuance of genetic studies breeding more mutant flu viruses likely to outbreak, inside trading scandals involving pandemic savvy White House and drug industry officials, curious immunity of these pharmaceutical entities over the past century to law enforcement and mainstream media scrutiny, and published official depopulation objectives. With the revelations and assertions advanced herein, the public is forewarned against this physician-assisted mass murder best termed "iatrogenocide."* This genocidal imposition is expected to serve mainly economic and political depopulation objectives. <br /> <br /> Background<br /> <br /> In April, 2003, a social experiment called SARS, said to have arrived from Asia, heavily struck Toronto. I was there throughout most of this Asian flu-foreshadowing fright. This bizarre new pneumonia-like illness was named Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome. It was said to be the latest threat in an ongoing series of attacks on humanity by mysteriously mutating "supergerms." <br /> <br /> A careful study of the scientific and medical-sociological correlates and antecedents of this "outbreak" revealed something amiss far more insidious than SARS. I critically considered Toronto's media reaction as any Harvard-trained public health expert in media persuasion behavioral science might. The scourge had all the earmarks of a novel social experiment conducted by white-collar bioterrorist. <br /> <br /> It seemed clear to me that this unprecedented population manipulation effectively indoctrinated the mass mind in support of a grossly ineffective, albeit legislated, public health response in advance of the arrival of "the Big One." Throughout the "SARS Scam,"(1) repeated references were made to biological agents that might facilitate decimation of approximately a third to half of the world's population. Having extensively reviewed political population control literature and contemporary objectives of leading global industrialists, I noted these predictions were in close keeping with current official population reduction objectives.(<br /> <br /> (2) Canada's response to SARS in 2003 was, for the first time in history, directed by the United Nations and World Health Organization (WHO). Having reviewed the intimate financial and administrative ties between these organizations, the Rockefeller family, Carnegie Foundation, and the world's leading drug makers, "the fox," in essence, reigned over Canada's "chickens." <br /> <br /> The truth about plagues includes the fact that "no grand pandemic ever evolved divorced from major socio-political upheaval." SARS advanced a political agenda more than a public health emergency. If public health officials earnestly intended to prevent these new emerging diseases, or successfully treat them at their roots, I repeated, they would study their obvious origins from the merged military-medical-biotechnology arena. A basic course in medical sociology simply justifies this utilitarian counsel. <br /> <br /> "Experts" had been predicting the arrival of a super-plague for decades. What was HIGHLY SUSPICIOUS about the mysterious and terrifying arrival of SARS, however, was its timing. It synchronously arrived with the global war on terrorism, and the Anglo-American war with Iraq. It seemed a convenient distraction from the fact that the earlier Bush administration had shipped Saddam Hussein most of his deadly biological weapons arsenal including anthrax and West Nile Virus. <br /> <br /> SARS was pathognomonic ( i.e., symptomatic and characteristic) of what I had predicted and explained in the book, Death in the Air: Globalism, Terrorism and Toxic Warfare (Tetrahedron Publishing Group, 2001; http://www.healthyworlddistributing.com/), a prophetically-titled text that predated the 9-11 attacks on America by several months, and provided a contextual analysis of certain globalists' links to recent "outbreaks." <br /> <br /> <a href="http://www.bangladesh-web.com/news/view.php?hidDate=2005-11-12&hidType=HIG&hidRecord=0000000000000000070510">continued</a><br /> <br /> [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> <br /> The Carnegie Foundation is controlled now by the Rockefeller Foundation. The Carnegie haven't had influence for a long time.

[Perturbed]

[QUOTE BY= Milton] Neither polio or smallpox has been eradicated from the world, it may be that smallpox was kept as a biological weapon but it is still with us, witness the small outbreaks in Africa in recent years. Polio appears to have been caused primarily by the improper treatment of sewage and secondarily by polio vaccinations. A google search using either name will tell the tale. <br /> <br /> <p>The point is that we are on a fascist highway, everything is being fast tracked for the coming strait jacketing of Western societies.<br /> The ruling class does not need us anymore. We have invented the machinery which can do the jobs that we formerly had to do. Now they have to figure out how to dispense with us. A nice little outbreak of something or other might do the trick. The old "Jim Jones" take this, it is good for you ploy.<br /> <br /> <p>When you grow up in society like ours, where the truth is hidden and lies are the commandments you are educated with, any actions taken have to be scrutinized with unrelenting fervor because we are ignorant and therefore our own worst enemies. <br /> [/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> <br /> You never asked the obcious question Milton: why the hell did our government not at least temporarily suspend air travel to China? Likely because they are so obsessed wuth enforcing their "borderless", one-world socialist ideology.<br /> <br /> Also, why do we not screen immigrants for TB, malaria, HIV/AIDS and others diseases? The countries where most of our immigrants now come from--China, India, Pakistan etc... are all world leaders in these serious illnesses.

[Jesse]

Perturbed, this has nothing to do with immigrants. Stay on-topic.