[Dr Caleb]

Hey Kevin! Long time!<br /> <br /> Yes, I'd agree that Canada has few charimatic leaders right now. Joe Clark wasn't all that charismatic, but he was the last of the 'progressives'. And he's always trotted out as an object of ridicule. Thank you, Brian.<br /> <br /> Personally, with the US's propencity towards electronic voting, and the hijacking of their democracy, I wouldn't want to be them.<br /> <br /> Our constitution was handed to us by the British House. I think it's in need of some 'pimping'. But there is no one willing to do that in Parlament currently.

[whelan costen]

Hey Kevin, good to hear from you!<br /> <br /> and just because you asked, 'you are a pessimist' ha ha<br /> <br /> I do however disagree completely with your view on this one, we don't measure the quality of a country based on the charisma of the leaders. They have Hollywood! That doesn't show the reality that most Americans are living. So a leader that can move us emotionally, or inspire us is very good as long as it translates into action. Think Ghandi.<br /> <br /> Having Canada absorbed into the U.S. , even if we have a very charismatic leader won't make your life or mine, or our future generations lives any better. We the people behind the Bill of Rights, once we understand it and start to act like responsible citizens, can make our country the leader it should be.<br /> <br /> Anyway good to hear your views once again! <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/biggrin.gif' alt='Big Grin'>

[Diogenes]

KevinGagnon, Hello<br /> <br /> We humans are identifiers, for sure. The problem with that though is it is done to the exclusion of all the other things we are or can be <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/rolleyes.gif' alt='Rolling Eyes'> <br /> <br /> Labelers, more than likely out of the own poor sense of self worth are compelled to come out of the chute bucking and snorting <br /> I've done it my self But when your balls have been squeezed you tent to re-act.<br /> <br /> "You" is a figure of speech<br /> <br /> Kevin Gagnon is Kevin Gagnon the holder of what he holds shifts, lingers and is replaced, or not and that is as it should be.<br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br /> <br />

[KevinGagnon]

Thanks for the responses. And thanks for the welcome.<br /> <br /> I believe it more then charisma. It has to do with ideas that are progressive. Progressive ideas are very attractive to me, and I can only find progressive ideas in politics in the U.S. <br /> <br /> Who close to power in Canada has any signs of strong progressive ideas.<br /> <br /> I know I'm being pessimist. I think I needed to let out some steam. Kidding.<br /> <br /> Kevin

[Dr Caleb]

[QUOTE BY= KevinGagnon] <br /> Who close to power in Canada has any signs of strong progressive ideas.[/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> Well, Umm . . I'd say CAP or Green. Those are the only two IMHO that show any sort of vision. Both are fiscally conservative, both stress 'Canada' first. two different platforms, but not unlike where I would guess David Orchard or the old PC's would be now.<br /> <br /> That being said, I don't know WTF is going on behind the scenes at CAP, but they better not be going all 'Liberal' (note the capital 'L') on me.<br /> <br /> [QUOTE BY= KevinGagnon] <br /> I know I'm being pessimist. I think I needed to let out some steam. Kidding.<br /> <br /> Kevin[/QUOTE]<br /> <br /> Give'er!

[gaulois]

Welcome back Kevin. The US is probably more in a need of "fresh air" than we are. It's all "markets" they say down there too. I'd rather go for Gandhi, if that's a "market". He is the one that said that one must project oneself what one sees the world as lacking. Not much of a market guy IMO. But I'm buying that.

[KevinGagnon]

<p>What attracts me most about progressive voices and ideals, is they actually show a willingness to find common ground with opposition. The bickering between left and right, nothing gets done. It's all about political strategy against eachother, and not as much about important policy. <br /> <br /> <p>The way it is now left will oppose right policy even if the policy is something they would support if they thought about it themselves. Same on the other end, the right will oppose the left policy even if the policy is something they would support if they thought of it themselves. There is like this idea that they can't be seen supporting opposition in fear that it may hand them votes at election. It's all about politicking. If politics continues like this democracy fails us. <br /> <br /> <p>Seems to me true democracy reveals itself in certain times in history, shows itself and something very important gets delt with, then we go back to getting nothing done until the next time it shows up. <br /> <br /> <p>I've read allot of leadership books and from what I learn about leadership skills, many politicians lack those leadership skills. I think ever single politician should have leadership skills, because three important qualities would help politics and that's (1)Finding common ground. (2)Being able to admit wrong (3)Put yourself in the shoes of the other person to try and understand where they are coming from.<br /> <br /> <p>I know I'm probably crazy to think we will see those qualities from politicians. <br /> <br /> <p>Kevin<br /> <br />

[Innes]

There is no guarantee that progressive voices are going to succeed in the United States. However, recently progressives have again found their voice through the media and elsewhere in the U.S. which is a good sign. It is not that there are no progressive voices in Canada but that they are not "in" at the moment. The media prefer the politics of conflict rather than the politics of consensus building. They promote the right/left divide. It makes better sound bites and they consider it more entertaining.<br /> <br /> Until Canadians find an alternative to the current MSM, or change their attitudes, no progressive voices will emerge into the mainstream. I have noticed that some of the older progressive literature has been reprinted suggesting that there is someone with money trying to bring back that kind of thinking. It is through alternative media (documentary, publishing) that progressives in the U.S. have made the break through back into the MSM.<br /> <br /> From the perspective of a political junky the situation has become so ridiculous that I rarely bother watching question period or any of the political commentary shows because they have become such a joke. It is not even entertainment anymore it is so bad.<br /> <br /> Remember that the re-emergence of progressive voices in the U.S. is quite recent and they just went through years of promoting the neo-con agenda. There is hope for us too.

[KevinGagnon]

<br /> Hello all. Thanks for the responses. Especially you Innes <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/smile.gif' alt='Smile'> <br /> <br /> Forgive me for not being up to date on this. But does anyone know about Trudeau running for the Liberals? Not even sure what his first name is. I haven't heard anything about him, but then again I haven't watched much Canadian news for a while. The only time I heard of him was through a guy at work who claimed that if Trudeau ran this Liberal leadership race that just past, he would have won. And apparently he will run in the next leadership race. <br /> <br /> Is there any truth to that? Is he progressive? Or big " L " <img align=absmiddle src='images/smilies/mad.gif' alt='Angry'> <br /> <br /> Kevin

[4Canada]

Hi Kevan,<br /> <br /> Regarding Justin Trudeau: He has been considering running in the next election but still has not made that official.<br /> <br /> His was supporting Gerard Kennedy in the Liberal leadership race and Kennedy would have been my pick out of the bunch with Dion as second. I believe he is a Suzuki fan. They both contributed to a documentary to support the Boreal Forests a while back. <a href="http://www.borealcanada.ca/news_e.cfm?p_id=221">see here</a><br /> <br /> His training is as a school teacher and he has the most vivacious wife named Sophie and they were both on the Rick Mercer Monday Report this past Monday that you can download from the CBC site.<br />

[KevinGagnon]

<br /> <br /> Hello 4canada,<br /> <br /> Thanks for your time. I do recall watching that documentary now. Just didn't realize that was the same Trudeau. <br /> <br /> I wonder if Trudeau supported Kennedy moving his support to Dion? If this Trudeau is going to be as popular as they say, and run in the next election, I hope he has more logic then that. Sorry just don't see how Dion can be a leader of a country. That's just my opinion. <br /> <br /> Kevin

[Brother Jonathan]

Kevin,<br /> <br /> keep in mind just how a President is elected down here; not by a tally of popular votes, but only by the 538 members of the Electoral College, of whom none is constitutionally bound to mirror his state’s/district’s popular vote.<br /> <br /> I am surprised at the effect of Senator Obama’s book upon you. Ironically, I see your voice in the House of Commons as being much more prominent than my voice in the House of Representatives, given the average number of voters per riding vs. the average number of voters per Congressional district. (In my case, the state of Vermont sends two of the 100 Senators and one of the 435 Representatives to Washington.)<br /> <br /> Our Constitution is, I think, an interesting document; it shows us (or at least the Founders) as being simultaneously idealists and pragmatists — sometimes in the best sense of both words, sometimes in the worst sense. In what way do you mean for the Charter and the Constitution to “come together”? Do you mean through the creation of some sort of fusion between the two? Or is your meaning more metaphorical?

[KevinGagnon]

I really meant the coming together under a entire new charter or new consitution. Something that would be written up for both sides. If you play with that idea, assuming it was very possible for it to happen. I see how between the two countries we can certainly come up with a common charter or consitution that would have input from both sides. Maybe our voting system can spill over into yours and we can have something totally new. Or just adopt a whole new voting system that is more democratic then the two of them. Since ours in Canada is flawed as well.<br /> <br /> Note that this is simply rambling out of my frustration with the lack of strong progressive leadership in all of our parties in Canada. And Barack Obama's attraction is that in my opinion he is a visionary progressive politician. <br /> <br /> We don't need leaftish or rightish proliticians trying to brain wash the masses with their ideology through political tactics, media sources. We need strong progressive politicians to come back to do the changes that this generations needs. Is Barack Obama a politician that can bring the two sides together for real debate?. I think so.<br /> <br /> Will Barack Obama attract cynical people. The people who once were political, once were voters? In my opinion he will attract many from that group. And it will be more prevalent as time goes by. <br /> <br /> Kevin

[Brother Jonathan]

Kevin,<br /> <br /> by “strong progressive leadership”, would you give examples of what would you like to see coming from each of the political parties in Ottawa? Take Kyoto compliance; would you like to see a Conservative proposal, followed by a Liberal, NDP, and/or Bloc counterproposal, <i>&c.</i>, with the give and take reflected in the Commons? Or would you rather see a cross-party collection of MPs work in committee, emerging with a consensus document on “how to get there from here”?<br /> <br /> Regarding the hypothetical <i>Carta americana septentrionalis</i>, I’m happy to play with the idea, despite it being extremely unlikely to happen. Do you envision a Westminster-style parliamentary system, or a presidential system, or some sort of hybrid? Would the provinces/states/distinct components of whatever name be sovereign? Would the freedoms of expression and assocation allow the existence of an organisation dedicated to denying certain freedoms to some subset of people? Should any crime be punishable by death? Should the right to keep and bear arms be guaranteed? Under what conditions, if any, would secession be permissible? Should there be official languages, and if so, which ones? Would there be distinct rights and freedoms for aboriginal peoples? Would the “notwithstanding clause” be retained or discarded? Let the convention commence …<br />